"Hasdrubal bodyguards" Topic

Hello all,
I'm currently painting up a few hundred figures for a game next year, Trebbia, to be precise, and I have a question, a bit obscure, I'm afraid!
I'll need to paint a command stand for Hasdrubal, l have some nice spearmen I may well add to the base as a sort of bodyguard.
Now these bad boys have some nice, large, round shields, and I'm wondering what to paint on them.
I know Carthaginian spears had all sorts of individual designs, and have had a lot of fun painting them up for the close-order African spearmen.
I suppose what I'm asking is, did Hasdrubal have a particular 'heraldry' for want of a better word, that I could use for these shields, or just go with individual designs.
Told you it was a bit obscure! Was Hasdrubal associated with any particular symbol?
Thanks for any help, or even tenuous suggestions!

Cheers, John

My best guess.

The family name means lightning so maybe a lightning symbol on their shields would do. Something similar but different to Roman shields maybe.

Ahhhh, thats a good idea!
I may well do that, thanks a lot Duncan, (I presume?)

John

Didn't know that. A lightning symbol is a very good idea. Might have to steal that myself!

Cheers

A bit late I know, but the Hasdrubal at the Trebbia wasn't Hasdrubal Barca, so the lightning bolt idea is, I am afraid, a complete red herring. Hasdrubal Barca, Hannibal's brother, was commanding the Carthaginian forces in Spain at the time.

Basically, there were at least three senior Punic officers called Hasdrubal who get mentioned during the 2nd Punic War:

Hasdrubal, Hannibal's brother, so a Barcid;
Hasdrubal Gisco, prominent in the Spanish and North African theatres;
Hasdrubal, a subordinate of Hannibal's during at least the early stages of the march to Italy and the "Big Three" early victories, trusted with the cavalry wing which delivered the offensive strikes that destroyed the Romans at Cannae.

AAhhh, Great information DB,
It's not too late, as the game isn't until April, but, I do have a lot of 54mm figures to paint! As I said, this era is quite new to me, so I have to plead ignorance, and I did indeed, think it was 'the' Hasdrubal.

So, if I may pick your brains a little more? so, was just 'Hasdrubal' at the Trebbia? is Trebbia one of the 'big three? (with Cannae, and, maybe, Lake Trasime?),and would you have any idea as to a suitable shield design for his bodyguard?

Thanks again DB, great information.

John

IMHO the 'big three' were Lake Trasimene, Cannae and Zama. Which. on aggregate, was a 2-1 win to Carthage. Zama, of course, being the important away win.

An away win to Rome, of course!

When Lucius Marcius defeated Hasdrubal son of Gisgo in Spain (according to Livy, who says he got it from Claudius Quadrigarius' Latin translation of Acilius' Greek annals),

"… and a vast amount of booty was taken. And in this he says that there was a silver shield weighing a hundred and thirty-seven pounds, bearing the likeness of Hasdrubal Barca. … They say that as a memorial of his victory over the Carthaginians, down to the burning of the Capitol there was in the temple a shield called the Marcian, bearing a likeness of Hasdrubal." (Livy xxv.39)

So (if we discount the enormous weight, and assume one of the writers got their Hasdrubals mixed up) maybe Hasdrubal's guards carried a shield with their boss's portrait?

Oh, dammit! Portraits?!? Why can't it be lightning bolts!
More great information tho' thanks!
John

If you really want lightning bolts, you could always rationalise it by assuming that the Hasdrubal who served under Hannibal in Italy is not sufficiently important as a Carthaginian grandee to have his own "heraldry", so is using that of his master, Hannibal. Also means that you can always use him as Hasdrubal Barca if you ever play either the Spanish campaign or the battle of the Metaurus.

The "Big Three" early victories I was referring to in 218-216 are Trebbia, Trasimene and Cannae.

DBS303, Thats great, Im going to go with that for the game! nice.
That is also what I see as the 'big three' Given it's repercussions for Carthage I see Zama as the 'Big One'!

Right, still ploughing through, painting endless 54mm Italian allies, for the Romans.

Thanks again!

John

Hmm, 54mm and April. Wonder what show that could be