"Who makes REAL 28mm Late Medieval / Renaissance Figs?" Topic

I was trying to get figures to match my Games Workshop Empire Figures, who are large 28mm. I think I made the right choice with Artizan Lansknechts, as a few people said they were "large".

However, I was then trying to get cavalry to match them, and ordered two units from The Assault Group, but now I think my Reiters and Hungarian Lights will be 25mm.

So far, it seems the 28mm I know for this period is:

Games Workshop (Empire, perhaps Brettonians)
Artizan
Front Rank

What others are in this larger scale? If someone would please say TAG, then I can at least not worry about THAT order being a mistake! But don't lie to me just to make me feel better it'll just make opening the package worse!
:P

Also, where the heck does Perry get off labeling their stuff 28mm? They are perfectly compatible with Old Glory and Foundry who are as 25mm as one can find!

GW stuff these days are more like 30mm. There has been a little scale creep in the line over the years.

Damon.

Have you looked at Tiger Miniatures Landsknechts they should be what you are looking for.

My Empire are 6th edition. They stand almost exactly 3mm taller than my Old Glory, which are Modern 25mm (as opposed to "True" or old 25mm, which were smaller).

I'll add that my Front Rank War of Roses look the same, and we'll see how the ARtizan look when they arrive.

My TAG Italian Scrapoli are about the size of my Perry plastics, so should be a bit smaller than 6th Ed Empire figures?

I think you can hardly tell once you rank them up though. If anything I think the size of the horses may be more telling.

link

Artizan are bigger than TAG/Perry but still not as large as those Empire plastics, but work with the 1990's metal figures. OG and Foundry are slightly smaller than even the 1990's metal GW figures, but will work together.

Front Rank work, as you noted. Redoubt also will likely work, though some of the sculpts are really old style. Black Tree Design will also supposedly work--I have ordered some to see for myself but they haven't yet arrived.

Also, where the heck does Perry get off labeling their stuff 28mm? They are perfectly compatible with Old Glory and Foundry who are as 25mm as one can find!

They are 28's. Artizan and others are actually "heroic" 28s or more like 32mm.

There are a load of comparison photos of different manufacturers here….

28mmreview.blogspot.co.uk

Don't yet have any for your period but what is there may be of help.

I also have a list of manufacturers of 16th Century figures here. There maybe some you have missed and want to take a look at?

link

I don't think you'll be disappointed by your TAG figs but I'm not sure. I have a bunch of TAG TYW figs and they seem quite big to me. They mix fairly interchangeably with Redoubt ECW figs and are bigger than Foundry or OG of the same era.

I would like to hear when you get them….

TAG are great figures, but they are no higher than 28mm to the top of their heads. They're on a scale with the Perrys but are noticeably slighter in height and build than GW Warhammer plastics. Artizan's the closest, or the Foundry Swashbuckler range – but that is perhaps a bit late 16th century to mix with the Empire. Some of the character models might work for command figures though.

when the ARtizan and TAG arrive I'll post some details, but probably not photos as I don't think I can post photos here.

My rather crude Comparison photos here:

link

link

Renegade figures are larger 28mm 'ish figures.
Redoubt are about the same size.

I always thought of GW as 32 to 34mm in size? Most current 28mm lines actually scale up to original 30mm lines. The problem you have is applying a fantasy line to historicals. Being fantasy allows for an anything goes attitude to scale creep.

Renegade do not make early 16th century figures though.

I wish everyone in the historical and especially fantasy end of the miniatures hobby could embrace the Barrett scale method of sizing figures. So many people start discussing 36mm or whatever figures solely because they have a big hat, rather than focusing on the size of the actual figure from flat feet to eyes/head. Drives me nuts. Abraham Lincoln is not a 32mm scaled figure versus his 28mm ACW range because he has a top hat on.

>However, I was then trying to get cavalry to match them,

About the only company that produces miniatures that matches GW horses is Gamezone.

The horses of the GW line are HUGE and cannot be combined with any other line. Of the usual other brands, Eureka are on the small side, but Foundry, Perry and/or TAG mix well despite minor side differences.

The GW Empire knights make a fine base for Gensdarmes, but ultimately lack historical authenticity and variety to be used soley on their own, so I would advise to skip GW for cavalry.

BTW: "Reiters" in their classic usage as black armoured double pistol only show up on the European battlefields at a time that does not combine with the GW Landsknecht style miniatures. The era from 1540-1600 is not really well covered in miniatures yet (aside from the new Tudor line of TAG).

I have a unit of old GW Voland Venators, sculpted by Perrys years ago and they're nice and as historical as GW can be – normal full plate armor without any sculls and roses.
link
The only company that matches GW in sizes of the horses as far as I know is Gamezone, however I don't think you'll find their models historical enough. They're also all metal and not on a cheap side….

The "Birdman of Catrazza" on Barins link make a good Leonardo-invention, though – just in case you want to build a little Diorama. GW also has a perfect Leonardo somewhere :-)

For slightly earlier, I'd probably run with Front Rank cavalry. Also, some of the old Grenadier figs from Mirlton probably work.

Gamezone look perfect!

Also, the Original Grenadiers now carried by Mirlton are perfect – I actually had some I didn't know where Grenadier in my WoTR collection!

OK, in light of the comment by a few above, I measured an empire spearman – 6th edition – the most vertical one around. Seems like from sole of foot to top of head he's 30mm.

So seems like my solution is to rid myself of Empire stuff over time and replace it with historicals.

Those of you who feel that Abraham LIncoln Vampire Killer is 42 mm tall b/c of his hat…stuff it.

:)

Gamezone Imperial are based on Spanish if the mid to late 16rh century. The motions are a dead giveaway in that regard.

They are gorgeous figures though.

And can be used with Reiters :-)

Good god… Just reread my post above. I really need to wear my glasses when posting!

"Morions" not "motions."

"of" not "if"

I wish everyone in the historical and especially fantasy end of the miniatures hobby could embrace the Barrett scale method of sizing figures.
-------------
though expecting that is like expecting everyone to agree who the world's hottest film starlet is or whether Union or League is the proper game – gamers being gamers will never happen – some like heroic, some like slight build – each to his own – of course there's an issue in mixing in units, but ultimately if one does a game where the opponent turns up with say Renegade WOTR and the opponent has Perrys or whatever, you're not going to not play them (the sight sometimes of Renegade ECW cavalry being charged by say 1st Corps 30YW Horse can look a bit odd but its a game)

link is a listing of all the 25/8/"about that high" Renaissance manufacturers I've found, although GW isn't on it (currently)

very interesting, never heard about some of these ranges.

Those Empire 6th edition plastics are far and away the bigger figures that cause all of the problems--the older metals and even the newer plastics can be matched, but not those plastics. I kind of wonder about the business/modeling decision that went into producing them--I would think it was a deliberate choice.

My comments about adopting the Barrett scale is not at all analogous to picking better versus worse figures--it is merely a common language to discuss the differences.

Artizan vs. Empire 6th:

I also found this photo taken off the net sometime ago comparing Late Medieval foot figures:

actually when holding them next to each other, the differences between my mirleton Grenadier figs and Foundry weren't as apparent as I thought. However the bulk of the miniatures made them seem a bit out of scale.

So perhaps the height isn't even the issue as much as the bulk.

The size issue is not terribly important. Even the "bulk" is not as important. Just look at the diversity of sizes in the human race. My only issue usually relates to very noticeable differences in weapon girth and length for weapons that are supposed to be almost identical. For pikes this is easily remedied. For swords and the like, not so much. This is more important, in my view, in later periods when standardization of musket sizes, for example, came along. Huge differences in the size could make units of mixed figures look odd.

that's a really good point.

I will say that mixing on a stand or unit the above Front Rank with the Old Glory and Mirlton seems to produce mixed results (especially the Mirlton). But perhaps not so much in the army overall.

My Artizan and TAG figures arrived. The TAG are the same size as Old Glory – so not 28mm as advertised, a bit disappointing, altho the sculpts are exceptionally well done. The ARtizan are bigger but they still don't seem quite as large as my 6th edition GW Empire. They are at least comparable to Front Rank and truly 28mm.

RW Philip:
"I wish everyone in the historical and especially fantasy end of the miniatures hobby could embrace the Barrett scale method of sizing figures."

RW, how about we just rate them here at TMP and then get the result posted in some permanent spot? It would be a great service by TMP to the community, and perhaps once the sculptors and manufacturers see that they are being scaled by the community regardless of their claim they will also advertise themselves more accurately.

Personally, I think that people are saying they sell 28mm just b/c "bigger is better". So it's not scale creep, it's marketing creep when the figure is really a 25mm Old Glory compatible.

throw the GW figures away and buy real 28mm historical figures :-)

Personally, I think that people are saying they sell 28mm just b/c "bigger is better". So it's not scale creep, it's marketing creep when the figure is really a 25mm Old Glory compatible.

Well, the original 28mm measured 25mm to the eye level. That's what some of he older lines used. Heroic 28mm measured 28mm to the eye level. The latter are really 30-32mm, not 28mm. So, the older manufacturers are not calling their figures 28mm because the term is in vogue. It is a clear case of scale creep.

I have samples (and then some) from all late medieval/early renaissance manufacturers.

I have been on a collecting binge of Renaissance/GW Empire figures across a ton of ranges and have hopes of trying my hand at comparison photos.

I think people are correct, though, that a bigger problem is weapons than bodies, and the heft/bulk second, with height actually a distant third.

Try googeling Lead Adventure miniatures. They have a fantastic 'herioc' scal for the Renaissance.

Darrell.

Darrell Hindley Figure Painter:
darrellhindley.co.uk
Just Add Water II Blog (Painting etc):
link
La Journee Blog (Hundred Years War):
link
Gewalthaufen Blog (Late 15th Cebtury Blog):
gewalthaufen.blogspot.co.uk