McLaddie | 07 May 2013 8:58 p.m. PST |
I have been thinking of getting started with some ACW ironclad fleets and have toured the sites offering models,[Thoroughbred kits looked good] but the rules blurbs found at various placed don don't tell you much. What are some of the popular ironclad rules about and what are their strong points? I have GMT's new Iron & Oak, but that doesn't really lend itself to tabletop sailing. |
David Manley | 07 May 2013 10:02 p.m. PST |
i have three sets that I've been working on over the years. The first and most developed is "Iron and Fire" which, along with an ACW supplement (that goes into greater depth in terms of ship data) is available from A&A Game Engineering. they seem to be quite popular and, although I do say so myself, have been generally well received. Strong points I would day are "comprehensive coverage with a period "feel" and moderate complexity, emphasizing ease of play and the "fun" aspect of wargaming" – which I guess is the ethos behind all the rules I've written. The other two are variants on existing rules. The first is a "man o War" variant written for quick play fun games at wargames shows (building on the success of the "Privateer" AoS variant I use for NWS games). The second started as a variant based on MGP's "Victory at Sea" but has morphed into a distinct set in its own right |
Red3584 | 07 May 2013 11:00 p.m. PST |
Peter Pig's Hammerin' Iron rules are good fun. Smoke on the Water are the other set that that I've played
A bit more time consuming but a good set (and free!). Not sure where they live at the moment but the Ironclads Yahoo group is a good bet or the Freewargamesrules website. |
MajorB | 08 May 2013 2:02 a.m. PST |
Try "Portable Naval Wargame 1860 – 1870" here: link |
Rich Bliss | 08 May 2013 4:58 a.m. PST |
I have no idea what the current prices are, but see if you can find a copy of the old Yaquinto boardgame, "Ironclads". It's the first set of rules I played for the period and still the ones I like the best. It translates very well to the tabletop. |
Sundance | 08 May 2013 5:06 a.m. PST |
We've used Yaquinto's Ironclads, but really like Under Both Flags as well. Fairly simple and straightforward, but with enough to make it more than interesting each game. |
flicking wargamer | 08 May 2013 5:24 a.m. PST |
Sail and Steam is a simplified version of Ironclads. The bonus is that it comes with a data sheet for practically every ship that sailed in the period, including variants. |
Who asked this joker | 08 May 2013 6:45 a.m. PST |
I'll second Hammerin' Iron. I played it a couple of years ago at a convention and really enjoyed it. I am not big on Naval wargames but this one was a filler. Glad I played. |
6mmACW | 08 May 2013 7:32 a.m. PST |
Like any rule set debate, this only depends on what level of detail you want, how many ships you hope to use, and the temperament of the club/group where you play. Our club loves "Hammerin' Iron" for several reasons: Fast moving gameplay, great for many players, captures enough period detail without bogging down, minimal record-keeping. We especially enjoy the frequency of "critical hits," which gives you a great sense of how unpredictable and haphazard these ships could be. The only knock I have on the rules is the low quality of writing/presentation in the rule book. But it's a small price to pay for a good game. |
deephorse | 08 May 2013 9:25 a.m. PST |
I'll second 'Smoke on the Water'. Easy to learn, provide good 'fun' and they're free! link I've tried a few other sets and have always gone back to SOTW. |
ancientsgamer | 08 May 2013 3:11 p.m. PST |
Plus you get to cue up Deep Purple for every game! How cool is that? |
McLaddie | 08 May 2013 7:21 p.m. PST |
Being able to cue up Deep Purple is a plus, obviously. Thank you gentlemen. That has been a big help. |
daveshoe | 08 May 2013 9:09 p.m. PST |
I like Sail and Steam Navies from Bay Area Yards. They are easy to learn and play pretty quickly, although you will probably want to use the modified turn sequence posted on the Yahoo group. The rules include the ship charts for just about any Union or Confederate ship you would like to see and the Yahoo group has files to download for creating your own ship charts. I used to play Ironclads a lot, but Sail and Steam Navies took it over since it is easier to play and still in print. Here is the link to my initial comments on the rules: link |
deephorse | 09 May 2013 6:30 a.m. PST |
At least three rolls for every single gun Not if you don't hit there isn't! Hammerin' Iron is fun, but we found the 5,6 for a hit to be a bit too easy so we just use 6 for a hit. Doesn't this unreasonably reduce the chance of a hit at short ranges? I've never played HI so have no idea as to how this would affect hit probability (there may be various factors that would alter the chance). |
138SquadronRAF | 09 May 2013 10:41 a.m. PST |
Smoke on the Water is a fun set Now available free here: link |
fleabeard | 09 May 2013 2:40 p.m. PST |
Iron and Fire (and its supplement "Blue Steel, Grey Thunder") covers pretty much everything that you're likely to want to game, and in a way that's straightforward and surprisingly simple. You can buy the downloads at Wargame Vault. It captures the feel of 1860s naval fighting well (or at least it panders to my notions of what it was like!), you roll to hit based on range, the gun you're using and various modifiers, you roll hits to see what it is you've struck, compare penetration at whatever range to armour, and even if you're battering away at impregnable armour there's the slight chance a special hit will start a fire that might turn very nasty, or kill the captain or take off a chunk of armour. The rules on initiative are simple, but work well, movement utilises turning circles, there are simple sail-only rules, and BSGT lays out well-integrated rules for infantry and additional rules for forts & shore batteries. I suppose it works best for ACW, but the last game I played saw a British squadron of two Prince Consort class ironclads and a steam battleship take on the Solferino and two Gloire class ironclads. Things got off to a shocking start when the Solferino bottled it after the captain was killed (VERY unlucky, all France felt the shame), but the lead British ironclad lost armour from the starboard and was severely damaged by the remaining French ironclads before one of them was in turn battered to a wreck. I also have both editions of Hammerin Iron. They're much simpler than I&F, but boy are they good to play, and strangely authentic given their simplicity. I also use the 6s to hit only as per DTAS above. It halves the damage, which actually works fine and gives a longer game. |
Ceterman | 09 May 2013 2:49 p.m. PST |
It WOULD have been this: link I've been waiting for YEARS, but alas, I think you're too late
damnit! (not you, specifically, just us ACW navel gamers in general! I backed it with what I could, I've been out of work for 2+ years but I also think 22K is a lot of cash!) Peter |
EJNashIII | 10 May 2013 3:43 p.m. PST |
Iron and fire is the way to go. |
Private Matter | 18 Feb 2014 11:14 a.m. PST |
Smoke On The Water is a good set of rules that gives a nice fast game and its free. I recommend that you try it out since it's free so if you chose not to use them you haven't wasted your money. |
Master Caster | 19 Feb 2014 11:44 a.m. PST |
Smoke On The Water is available for free download on the Yahoo Ironclads Discussion group in our files section. (I tried the two links above but they don't pop up on my system.) You have to join the group to get all our downloads, flags, scenarios etc,,,,but you can unjoin at any time. Currently there are over 1100 members worldwide that are very knowledgeable, helpful and well-mannered. |
Didierb2 | 17 Mar 2014 6:55 a.m. PST |
Iron and Fire we love to put one "Gloire" turning around US monitors
.Altought the turret armor was immune to 6.4inches rifled guns, all other parts of monitors will be holed quite easily |
Tthirtyfive | 19 Mar 2014 7:23 p.m. PST |
At the opposite extreme from Smoke On the Water is a free (and very old) set from the Naval Wargames Society: link I like Smoke On the Water but it doesn't lend itself to larger actions but the NWS set does. |
StoneMtnMinis | 25 May 2014 8:45 a.m. PST |
You may also want to consider Age of Iron link |