"Last major retailer in the UK withdrawing from our hobby?" Topic

So, fresh from receiving my copy of Battlegroup Overlord, I set out after work to my local Hobbycraft (Coventry, UK) to pick up some foliage/paints/assorted bits. On arriving, I find that they're 're-fitting' for a 'new look.' After speaking to the staff, I find that this no longer includes modelling supplies "as they don't sell well – only the major stores will carry that kind of thing now." On asking where the nearest store might be, I was met with blank looks, and a suggestion of Birmingham. Are we really at the state where modelling supplies are no longer available outside the two biggest cities in the UK? :-(

Up in Yorkshire we have Boyes department stores selling odd things along with Modelzone although expensive still doing a decent range. Artist supplies fill some gaps too. So not all is lost.

There is this new thing called the internet. Perhaps you've heard of it? You can get all sorts of things delivered directly to your door. Check it out!

In Stroud we are blessed with Antics model shop, a decent art shop, Wilkinson and Dreamholme Scenics

Thanks Ken, yes I have heard of the internet – just the thing for looking at 2cm grainy pics of things I might want if I could see them in the flesh, and as a bonus I get to pay Royal Mail for shipping too!
On a serious note, I don't think it's good for gaming in general that GW seem to be the only 'bricks and mortar' stores now – how can you get new people into the hobby if you have to search the net to even find what's out there? Not likely to get many impuse buys of rulesets or figures that way….

how can you get new people into the hobby if you have to search the net

Shows, word of mouth, magazines, other shops, clubs, the gazillion webpages that show off the hobby, plenty of ways really if you want to.

Not likely to get many impuse buys of rulesets or figures that way…

Do many people start a new hobby on impulse though?

Yep, it's a shame, but a similar story to many types of product lines (our town has just lost a jewellers, gents outfitters and a camping type store – probably to be replaced by coffee shops or some such!) I can still source some model items from various shops, but it is quite hit and miss and I have to travel in different directions. We have a (part time) Games Workshop in a nearby town and a Modelzone in the next city. Outside of that we have a couple of model type shops within driving distance that have limited stocks of flocks etc.

I try whenever possible to buy from shops, simply to support them and keep them ticking over, as I get a simple pleasure from just being in them (like the equally rare camera shops really) but to get an overall full supply, I have to use wargame shows and internet shopping.

I did a 55 mile round trip to an excellent and well stocked dedicated wargame store last week and bought the Star Wars starter set as an impulse buy. I was with a friend who actually wanted some star wars stuff – and he bought the playing mat on impulse – just because it looked so good on display and he could physically handle it.

Two days ago, I order Clash of Wills as an internet purchase, I have no-idea who might stock such a thing within 100 miles or even more of here. Fortunately for Mrs. Smith, I have now run out of money – so taking her to one of the plentiful local coffee shops is the cheaper option for now!

The problem with this hobby is that there is just no damn money in it. Aside from the odd OlD Glory or Perrys there is no one retiring off the money they make in wargame products.

It's such a thin market and we are all cheap bastards-I applaud anyone in the business as it is a true labor of love.

The internet must surely generate more impulse purchases than real shops ever did.

Jaz
Http://revolutionaryroads.com – a new breed of wargaming road!

The problem with the internet is that post is harder to hide from the wife. If I buy in a bricks and mortar shop I can smuggle it into the man cave (also known as the garage) with out the good lady noticing…..

We truly are blessed in the Fens! There are three model retailers within an hours travel, so I can ignore my increasingly horrid GW store. Went to it to buy some paint and the assistant, under the GW prime directive, tried to sell me paint (ok), more paint (um no) and an expensive book on painting (no, no, no). I used to work in retail, so appreciate the desire to maximise sales, but we were also taught to never make a customer uncomfortable. I did, and have never been back.

I don't know what's going to happen to the models section in the Sheffield Hobbycraft but they ran down their stocks of spruce and balsa well over a year ago despite me cleaning it out over and over again. Modelling supplies don't sell well when they aren't in stock to be bought.

@ Ninjasaurus;

My thoughts exactly! My local " model shop" has declined to the point of selling embroidery supplies! Great, they've got 50 tank models, but they're all in 1/35th. and of the same damn tank!

I believe that focus and a good depth of stock is what hobby stores need to make money. " If you stock it, they will come." Mine when I retire won't be stocking emboidery supplies!

Hi there, I work at a Hobbycraft store in the West Midlands. No two stores carry the same stock, in it's simplest form it's down to floor space and local demand. At my store we are actually increasing the amount of modelling supplies we offer due to demand but in my opinion it's still not enough. Unfortunately for our hobby if something doesn't sell in stores like Hobbycraft it is removed and replaced with something that does; hard headed business.

We have demo days to display to the public what we do in order to drum up interest (in my store there are a few keen modellers and wargamers) but we are limited to only using the products we sell. Shame really as it's a kind of Catch 22, we want to share our passion for the hobby and we have a captive audience but we're limited to how we go about it.

Here's the problem with depth of stock. I have packs of 15mm Napoleonic Landwehr that are 7 years old. "if you build it they will come" only works in the movies. Space is too expensive. If it won't turn twice a year you're losing money, that simple.

Thanks for your perspectives, Thunderchicken and Extra Crispy. I understand the problem of holding stock that might not sell (which is why I run a business that provides a service rather than a product!) but what I don't understand is why, when I continually – and frequently – returned for supplies of spruce and balsa sticks and kept that section of the store active, they stopped reordering anyway. The only reason I can think of for not reordering is that the maker of the wood supplies is in the USA, so perhaps the import duties has made it a pain for Hobbyscraft to do so.

But it's also a pain to get to Hobbycraft so I've just given up and stopped going. I might return if there's something else I need so I've not abandoned them but, in effect, they've lost a regular customer. When I think about how much it costs on the bus to get there and back, and no guarantee of anything being in stock when I get there, I will probably just have my next lot of wood supplies delivered to my door.

Is an Antics in Cov not far from the Transport Museum

I don't think it is isolated to Great Britian. I loved to do weekend trips to hobbyshops, but after being gone overseas for a year, most of my haunts have closed up. A few remain, but they are in the larger cities and use half of the store floor for gaming( tables and computer).
With gas prices and time, I have been using the internet more for shopping. For now, I still have Ed's Hobby and Collector shop in Waterviliet, Mi. All sorts of used and new model train stuff and the occassional airfix and tamiya kits some of which are out of print.
But Ed is getting old and his store may vanish soon too…like all the old bookstores and other hobbyshops in my area.

if our hobby depended on stray people picking up wargaming magazines for new blood, we would have died out before we started.

thankfully, our hobby depends on people taking an interest in history and enjoying indoor table games.

Its sad but that is one of the negative effects of having a vibrant internet service. Model shops are slowly dying but I just don't think its just recent either. Remember the old Beatties chain ?

I have a lad who is 12 so I can speak from experience here and the younger generation are just interested in hi tech computer consoles ,Blackberry chatting etc. When I was his age it was Airfix and Matchbox soldiers. Sadly times have changed and not necessarily for the better in some respects.

As a result I don't think the footflow is there any more in model shops as the younger generation find other pastimes.
I do also have concerns over Modelzone . I don't know if anyone has noticed but they seem to have a never ending sale of items on special offers. A lot of the Revell and Airfix kits are heavily discounted. These aren't just limited to OOP models either. I bought quite a few Forces of Valor Tiger 1 sets from them for under £10.00 GBP as I just happened to be looking for zimmed Tigers for Battlegroup Overlord for a future German Army.

Now on the plus side the internet has helped a lot of small cottage style industries to spring up. These probably wouldn't have been in existence without the internet. The internet is also handy for those who don't live near a hobby store as nearly everything is available.

The future really is going to be left to market forces . The simple truth is if we don't support our local shops then they will disappear.

AS regrds the hobby itself ,if I listened to the masses then our hobby ie wargaming would be dead and buried by now. I hear it nearly every year on some forum or other that there is no new blood and the hobby is doomed , yet we are still here alive and kicking and on the whole a vibrant hobby which still supports a few magazines as well.

AS regards new blood again I keep hearing there is not enough young people coming into our hobby. However I find it tends to be the 30 something that is our new blood coming back into the hobby after setting up a family. More than likely would have played GW games in his/her younger days.

Just my twopence worth :)

Milites where in the Fens are these model shops? I live right on the edge and love being able to just pop in and browse.

Model shops are certainly in short supply-nothing new about this of course.
It became increasingly unlikely that any one shop could actually stock what you wanted, so I was mostly ordering by post even before the internet.
We have a Hobbycraft in Chester, though the kit section has shrunk a lot, and they only sell Airfix. Little in the way of tools/materials. But a growing section on cup cake making!
We also have a Modelzone, which is more diverse and useful, and is my usual port of call for Vallejo paints, brushes, and some kits. Inevitably the stock can be quite random [apart from Airfix who seem to be everywhere and in force]so it is still a matter of internet buying for anything specific.
It must be an age thing, but I still have a perception that the internet is really for stuff you can't buy locally , and I persist in expecting to get generic supplies like paints and brushes in person.Particularly with Vallejo paints, I like to be able to look at the bottle and see what the description of the colour really means.

I live in West Lancs and haven't seen a model shop in usable distance for years. The best bet is usually a railway modelling shop – I get re-stocked at one near my Mother-in-Law's when we visit.

There is a toy/cycle/model shop in ELY in the fenlands. My daughter lives there and that is another place I can use to stock up. I'm in there this coming Saturday when we are down for my Grandson's 2nd B'day.

Most wargaming has been mail-order or Internet for years in the UK. You were very lucky if you had a well stocked shop in your vicinity at any time over the last 50 years. Over that same period though the decline in model shops has been marked – 30 years ago I had a choice of about 7 or 8 now only 1 crap place in Liverpool that is overpriced and perpetually out of stock of almost anything I need.

It must be an age thing, but I still have a perception that the internet is really for stuff you can't buy locally ,

Well, if you don't have a local model shop …

Well my modus operandi is . Support the local shop and buy from there . For anything else which is quite a lot in truth he can't get in then it goes to the Internet.

The problem is that a lot of the small size miniature suppliers can't afford to give trade terms and therefore can't supply the model shop, hence the reason I end up ordering from the internet.

I think the new model for a successful hobby shop is one that uses the shop as a warehouse to store stuff they're selling on the internet. If you're local that's a great benny for you. Otherwise it's waiting for the next gaming convention to see what's for sale…

Ascent, Ely has City Cycle Centre and Huntingdon has a recently opened model railway shop in the high street that stocks some modelling supplies.

Hobgoblin, don't forget Modelzone in Cambridge and Langleys Toymaster in Norwich.

Blimey, if someone's going to Norwich, they could be going to the one in Snetterton..

"There are three model retailers within an hours travel"

I can think of the one in Ely, ModelZone in Camb (although it's a pain to go to if you don't want to pay a fortune to park and can't walk very far) and the one in Trumpington[1]….

There's also Inner Sanctum which stocks paints and some modelling stuff. (But it's a pain to get to if you can't walk very far because there's no nearby parking).

[1] Which is psychic and knows what I want and arrange not to have it in stock.

On the original subject, I don't think the new Hobbycraft in Cambridge ever GOT the modelling stuff in and the one in Peterbrough appeared to be running the stock down last time I was there.

"Well, if you don't have a local model shop … "

True… I've been lucky that at any given point there's always been at least one place, either near work or home, where I could stock up on paint.
Vallejo paints in Modelzone are a huge plus.. I haven't had to set foot in the local GW for a couple of years!

I found Hobbycraft would focus on particular brands-it's Airfix at present, but they were big on GW at one time, and also Flames of War-now disappeared. If these were not your thing, there wasn't much else, and I haven't found them to be the cheapest of places anyway for generic supplies, either modelling or art.

Hobby shops have to change just like any other buissenes. My local shop stocks lots of collectable card games, ansd hosts an event at least once a month. Pain in the butt, but there are tons of kids buying cards there every time. And,,,,once in a while one of those kids checks out the historicals section. They even sell Munchkin(shudder).

But the shop is alive and well. If they carry anything I want, I get it from them, other than old glory. but even with special order, there is just to much I cant get through them. So the net gets more of my total dollar, but my FLGS gets a good bit.

owen

I think you have a point there Badger 22. Collectable trading card games are getting ever so popular ( the new GW ?) and requiring very little space in a shop could be their salvation. Speaking to a couple of Card Game players at our local gaming club, I was amazed at the sums of money that go into making up a typical deck. Seriously it made my eyes water . The serious tournament players can spend easily a thousand pounds on a successful deck!

" I have packs of 15mm Napoleonic Landwehr that are 7 years old. "

I can double that age with packs and packs of figures I bought on impulse years & years, ago and are still in my "to paint" heap. To see them on dislay, to handle them, was to buy them "just in case".

I have so many unpainted pewter and lead alloy figures in the house its put £6,000.00 GBP on the value of the house!!!! :)

Where do retailers add their USP?

It's service.

That means convenient opening hours, well stocked shelves and great knowledge and advice. "If you stock it they will come" might not be as strong a tip as it used to be, but "if you dont stock it they will stop coming alltogether" is as true as it has ever been. And it costs 10 -15 times more to acquire a new customer as it does to keep an established one.

Despite all the rantings on here, GW does still manage to have a very wide retail presence. They not only feed a market but actually create markets for their new product lines. That's pretty cool in business terms for this hobby. I guess there are enough folks into fantasty type gaming these days to make it pay. For us historical guys, its literally a dying market. We have to work harder to get what we need. But compared to my early years the range of stuff available is far wider and better quality than when I started out, and in real terms a lot cheaper too thanks to streamlined distribution channels such as the internet.

Ninjasuarus, it's a tough one to answer. In our store we've just doubled the size of our balsa wood stock with a fancy new display unit on its way. In addition we're about to start stocking styrene sheets for the first time. The two neighbouring Hobbycraft stores have been selling it for years and it took some lobbying to get it stocked in ours!!

Forrester, I know exactly what you mean. Cake making, bridal and kids craft are the biggest sellers at the moment so they get the space. It used to be card making and papercraft, in six months to a year the trend will shift again and the fitters will be back to rearrange the furniture.

KatieL, park and ride is the answer for Cambridge, free parking and £ 2.60 return, buses run every 10-15 minutes (longer interval in the evenings). Langley's in Norwich has the ground floor full of kiddies toys, but the top floor is an Aladdin's cave of all sorts of modelling goodies. It's about 10-15 minutes walk from the train station, in the arcade. You also walk past a ModelZone to get there.

London is the big disappointment, you'd think in a population of 8 million there could be one central games shop!

"Remember the old Beatties chain ?"

I remember going into the Beatties shops at Southgate after school; one was model soldiers, tanks and aircraft, mainly Airfix and Tamyia as I recall, and the other was serious model trains. There also used to be a toyshop nearby that carried an impressive range as well.

Beatties shiny shop at Holborn is now part of the Modelzone chain.

If you are in London I recommend looking into the 4D Model store under the arches in Leman Street (5-10 minutes walk from the Tower of London). It carries a large selection of brass strip and rod, plastic strip and rod, balsa wood, sheets of extruded polystyrene plus a selection of paints, glues and varnishes.

I have found Modelzone quite reasonable – in Doncaster they are very good and it seems every time I go to the counter to pay there is some deal going on and I get a reduced price. I've been mainly buying my WW2 1/72 -1/76 but some die cast vehicles were on sale for less than the price of the plastic kit version – and the paint job is reasonable.

Boyes is a blessing for Vallejo paints and in Doncaster and here in melton mowbray it is really a godsend.

never been too keen on Hobbycraft – they have lots of stuff for other hobbies but very little for ours and they are even downsizing their scenery stock as I found when I treked to Ventura park in Tamworth and found they had nothing -charming chap explained stuff was still available via the website but maybe Im old fashioned but I want take thinks with me there and then.

Is Modelzone in Doncaster, what used to be Tag Models?
If thats the case, I didn't even notice it was any different!!
What really does my head in about that place, is the sheer apathetic nature of the useless staff, and their attitude to customers. They are slack as fook!

To be honest, there's plenty of good places in Doncaster to get modelling supplies if you look around, as I'm sure plenty of other towns are like that too.

I find myself looking in the most unlikely of shops for modelling materials and supplies, but when it comes to the figures I need, my money goes to the net.

There is this new thing called the internet. Perhaps you've heard of it? You can get all sorts of things delivered directly to your door. Check it out!
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i was thinking on this recently after seeing yet another 'I'm visiting London or X are there are good games shops' type posts. To which the reply usually is very predictable!
Yes the internet is great and those of us who go on about the good old days sound like a load of old duffers, but nothing beats browsing around a shop and impulse buying!

Plus one very major downside of the internet is that items arrive by post or courier when one is out usually and will, along with the relevant bank/credit card statements, inevitably fall into the hands of the enemy to enable them to prepare an interview package of the 3rd degree to be sprung as you walk in the door. When you could go to a shop, allied with taking a few tips from smuggling programs on TV re packing, one could get them into the house and stowed away, so that if found later during the course of a search, they could be explained away as "those, had them for years – think they were half price". All that is sadly gone now!

Strangely attempts to apply the same tactics in reverse re those 'must have' shoes, that bargain dress etc result in "get your own tea" and a night on the sofa.

Here in Glasgow we have our own wargaming ghetto.
Some know it as Parnie St. One mixed games shop. One RPG and wargames shop and one hobby/model shop.

Modelzone in London at Holburn has closed down, if somebody the size of MZ is closing down their central store in London, then times are getting pretty tight. Great shame as it really was a well stocked store with excellent staff who knew their stuff and were aleays prepared to go the extra mile in terms of offering advice and suggestions. Great store.

Guess it reflects an overall social trend as we move away from shopping in general to relying on the internet.

Roman Walt,
Im afraid sign of the times, price and marketing will kill of most bricks and motar stores. Best option are railway shows tend to be a lot of em around and you can find some fab stuff ( most terrain innovations come via the model railways lot).
There are times when the internet just isnt the same as seeing things in real life.
L

Have recently returned to hobby now children are grown up, (more cash and space.) Both of the model shops I have used for years now sadly gone. Hobbycraft in Tunbridge Wells embarrassingly lacking in stock or choice. Mainly use Internet for purchases but still support Essex Miniatures and Minifigs this way. Dark Sphere in York Road SE1 opposite St Thomas Hospital has good range of FOW and fantasy items including Battlefield in Box range and of course Gale Force Nine trees etc. other than this I try and get to more shows and buy what I think I may need in advance.

What a interesting discussion :) Here in Reading we have hobby raft, model zone also GW, all very good if your into what they sell, what I would like is a shop that sells 6/10mm so I can pop in after work, pick what I want and come home and paint/build! The Internet as already been discussed is a brilliant resource but not very good for thoes who want it NOW! And not wait 28 days as some firms state, by then I get fed up waiting!! If firms like irregular minatures can do it, ie place order on Monday, items arrive by Thursday, Friday at latest, now that's service, other firms could follow this example maybe?

Jack123,
I think most do, workload allowing. Cant always have everything in stock even when your the manufacter.
L

Jack123
The Internet as already been discussed is a brilliant resource but not very good for thoes who want it NOW! And not wait 28 days as some firms state, by then I get fed up waiting!!
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thats a very good point – this is the instant generation yet if you order stuff over the internet and the customer service isn't too great (or more likely being a cottage industry then the manufacturer is busy at this normal job) then you can be waiting a few weeks. I still think nothing beats impulse buying.

Cheltenham has a Hobbycraft with a large stock of models when I was in this Monday looking for clay. We also have a model shop caterting to tmodel trains, remote control stuff and of course plastic kits.

Of course they neve have quite the thing I need whenever I do try to use them so end up on the internet anyway.

"Modelzone in London at Holburn has closed down"

So it has, I'm shocked.

Of cause not every firm takes 28 days delivery:)