"Later Flashman novels" Topic

Dear all,
can our membership give their views on the relative quality of the later (later written) Flashman novels? I can remember trying to read the one where he's at Harper's Ferry and the one set in Abyssinia, and they seemed, to me, a bit weak, as if the author was getting, either tired of writing them, or running out of ideas, or perhaps feeling obliged to write them, without the enthusiasm anymore.

I have to agree. I didn't enjoy them as much as the earlier novels that is fir sure. I think your assessment is pretty accurate.

I have had the same reaction. Some of the later books seemed a little off. That said, I have read every one and would never advise anyone to skip them.

Even when not on the mark, they still are better than most.

Vince

I'm thinking of re-reading the Mountain of Light, as I can barely remember it, but it is one of the later novels, I think.

I'm still near the beginning of the series, having just finished Flash for Freedom. So where is the break point? Do I still have a few good ones ahead of me? I'm getting ready to start Flashman at the Charge.

I think most people consider GMF peaked with Flashman at the Charge and the following Flashman and the Great Game.
Slowly downhill after that.

As long as it's a slow decline I should be in good shape for quite a while.

Is there point in reading any of the pastiche novels?

I think Choaun's assessment is good, although I enjoyed …Angel of the Lord and …On The March more on subsequent readings. …On The March was very much an obligatory piece, and GMF makes no bones about it being a commentary on military adventurism in the 21st Century.

For me, …Great Game is the masterpiece, and …Mountain of Light and …the Dragon are still up to snuff. The Subtleties of Baccarat is also a favorite.

The MacAuslan stories are brilliant (mostly) and Black Ajax is very good.

Avoid The Pyrates at all costs. The OFM and I are unanimous in this.

And, if you feel like watching some very good GMF, there are always the Richard Lester Musketeer movies. Very Flashmanesque, with a touch of MacAuslan.

In the Abyssinian one, he reverts to his SOB character by trying to kick Halle Berry over a waterfall! How can you call that a "decline"?
Fraser was DEFINITELY not losing interest. He thought this was British Imperialism at its finest.
My particular favorite is "Redskins".

I really like "Angel of the Lord", by the way.

Is there point in reading any of the pastiche novels?

No. just on general principles. I was nearly kicked off a Flashman Yahoo group for suggesting that.

Flashman & the Tiger is one I haven't even seen, although I beleive it includes "Baccarat". Worth looking for?

Yes, I would say they are all worth the read.

Vince

Absolutely.

Let's face it. The worst Flashman is better than the best Turtledove.

I liked Flashman's Lady. The description of Flashman inventing the hat trick in cricket is one of the funniest things I have ever read (it helps if you love cricket).

Aye, even the weakest (Tiger) turns out to be relatively strong. You have to be at least curious as to how an encounter with Sherlock Holmes would go down.

I'll recommend Brigadier Gerard by AC Doyle. It's similar in tone and laugh out loud funny though it centers on a pompous French cavalryman serving Napoleon I.

There's also a trio of novels by Raymond Saunders involving a Fenwick Travers – the "American Flashman" link but they are not nearly as good. Once you've read all of GMF go ahead and give Saunders a try.

Chouan, like the OFM said, any so-called 'bad' Flashman
is worlds better than the so-called 'best' Turtledove.

When you've run through the Flashmans, try Fraser's
_Mister American_.

BTW, have any of you sampled the first (of a projected
10) in the 'Speedicut Papers' books ?

Flashman at the charge. Which is triggered by a fart …all the books were wonderful. .. We all missed GMF writing about. flashman fighting on both sides in the ACW.. Quick lads. Which famous british fellow actually did?

Some sheepsh**ger I seem to recall…

Everything up to and including Angel of the Lord is worth anyones time in my view.

Tiger is alright but I think the wearyness is begining to show.

On the March just doesn't have the brio of his earlier books, all the elements are there but somehow he doesn't mean it any more.

Candlemas Road is a great little book although I suspect he may have written it as a screen play. Black Ajax and Mr American are fine books.

Tiger is alright but I think the wearyness is begining to show.

Tiger was written in 1975 or so, and appeared in a magazine.
If you mean the other sories in the collection, I disagree.
Baccarat was a wonderful portrait of Elspeth.
I might agree, slightly, that the Road to Charing Cross story was a bit of coasting. Almost the same story as Royal Flash.

I thought 'On the March' was a bit disappointing.

Abandoning the 'diary' format to open with a two-person dialogue was a huge mistake.
It strikes a really honking bum note.

We've had so many references to the Maximillian affair over the course of the series… but when the time comes, it's skipped over in a single chapter?! I felt short-changed.

'Kicking Uliba off the canoe' felt like a studied attempt to recapture the 'throwing Valla off the sleigh' moment. It smacked of trying too hard.

But the worst thing about OTM is that Flashman doesn't actually DO much. No cunning plans, escapades or shenanigans. He's basically a passive observer… pretty much along for the ride.

A nice short "story" and Flashy's exposure of Holmes as, er, fallible was well worth the read!

Another one who believes that the 'worst' genuine Flashman is still better than most of the other historical military fiction out there.

I like 'Black Ajax', 'Mr American' and 'The Pyrates' (but you have to get the joke).

Not yet found a 'Flashman tribute/pastiche' that I could enjoy quite as much, but 'Scoundrel' (an AWI diary written in similar style) and 'The Carton Chronicles (French Revolution) are worth reading.

The Flashman and MacAuslan novels are favourites of mine. Favourite Flashman: Flashman and the Great game. least Liked Flashman: Flashman's Lady.

I also love 'Quartered safe out here'. Steel Bonnets is good, if tiring, non-fiction.

Yeah, "The Pyrates" is alright if you don't take it seriously.

One wonders what, and when, a bundle of papers will be discovered in an attic with the long awaited ACW and Maximilian novels in 'em!

Sadly, spontoon, that's never going to happen – not an authentic one, at least.

The recently released "Flashman and the War between the States" is a poor pastiche/'tribute' to the series and best avoided if you like the originals. (see previous threads on this subject)

Well, I've nearly finished "Mountain of Light", which seems to me to be as good as any of them. My wife is unimpressed with the cover artwork, however, and my elder son refers to it as "erotica"…….. They won't belive that it's History really.

I second everyone here saying the worst Flashman books are still way better than any other historical fiction I have encountered. I didn't notice a decline per se, but some of the books are of course better than others.

Black Ajax is a very good book and similar stylistically to the flashman books. I loved Mr. American, but it is closer to more serious literature than Flashman. The reavers was just awful. Had I not read everything else by him and wanted more, I couldn't have actually finished it.

Wish he could have written a few more flashman novels.

THe problem is that "The Steel Bonnets" was straight History, not a novel, but the author's reputation meant that people bought it thinking it was Flashmanesque. I read a fairly solid, if pedestrian history of George Thomas, entitled "Rajah from Tipperary: George Thomas" which on the blurb described it as "a novel in the Flashman tradition". Anything to get on the bandwagon!

Just finished "Flashman and the Sea Wolf" (Robert Brightwell), being an account of Harry Flashman's uncle Thomas during the Napoleonic Wars and his adventures with Lord Cochrane.

One of the better 'tribute acts'- enjoyable historical fiction. It does not have the depth of GMF, but is still worth reading, and it has enough plausible links with the original series. This Flashman is not the same character as his nephew, but he shares some of his vices. I'm sure the author deliberately named his 'hero' Thomas as a small tribute to young Tom Brown who started it all.

I've ordered the second book (set in the Maharatta wars)and there are hints that Brightwell hopes for a series – I for one am looking forward to this Flashman's account of the South American Wars of Liberation, for example.

@SJWalker 38;

You don't think George Macdonald Fraser had any notes on his ACW novel? I like to believe that he must have had some and a basic plot premise. So, I live in hopes that a good writer of historical fiction will be offered the chance to co-author them; much like the Alistair Maclean and various co-author novels. Currently I hope the opportunity is given to Christian G. Cameron!

Spontoon;

Sadly, that's not the case. His daughter has made it clear that there are no unfinished manuscripts, first drafts or further notes that could be published. The GMF Flashman mother lode is exhausted.

AND avoid "Flashman and the War between the States" by Tighe – a very poor band-wagon jumper – which, interestingly, has been recently renamed to remove the Flashman name (copyright issues?") and now masquerades as "Sir Thomas "British Tommy" and…" Can anyone shed any light on this development?

BUT I can now happily recommend Brightwell's take on the genre – his second book "Flashman and the Cobra" is an excellent historical romp in the GMF tradition, and a marked improvement on his (good) first effort – not quite as much historical depth (yet) but 2 books in, the series is looking good, especially as it's mainly set in India during the Napoleonic wars.

By the way, there's a lot of Flashman 'tribute acts' popping up on Kindle right now:

"…and the knights of the Sky" features his grandson (also called Harry) in the RFC in 1915

Can't remember the quite poignant start to "Harpers Ferry" where a very elderly Flashman is with his grandchildren, but I'm not sure if this newly created descendent matches the name and age of any of them.

There's even a new series called the "Speedicut Papers"!

Ah well. I suppose imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.