"10. Prussian RIR 1813 Flag" Topic

I would like to add 3 btg of Reserve infantry to my prussian brigade, and it seems that the 10th Reserve Regiment may be an easy conversion from Perry plastic, simply removing the coat tails, but I would like to know if this regiment carried flags or not during 1813-14 period.
In the fantastic books from Dr. Summelfield (happy owner)I was not capable to find such an indication.
So I'm hoping in your help.
Thanks in advance.

The reserve regiments initially did not have flags. They were promised flags as a reward for the 1813 and 1814 campaigns, but received them only after the end of the 1815 campaign, most in September 1815.

So to simplify things a rgt with dark grey or black uniforms and no flags, quite a sight on the field….
Thanks Oliver for your precise indication.

Tenth Reserve Infantry Regiment

This Regiment was formed from Reserve Battalions of the First Silesian Regiment, and the officers and cadre wore its uniform (yellow facings with white shoulder straps). The remainder wore grey caps with a yellow band, tailless jackets with yellow collar patches, yellow metal buttons, grey shoulder straps with white bands across them, grey trousers, and black gaiters. The cartridge box had a black belt. Later, covered Prussian shakos were issued, with calfskin packs (with white straps), grey haversacks, and grey greatcoats, carried bandolier fashion. The I Battalion retained the grey colour of their jackets, shoulder straps and trousers, but these were dyed dark blue in the II Battalion and very dark grey, almost black in the III.

On March 25 1815, this Regiment became the First Rhineland Regiment and by June the majority of the men and all the officers, NCOs and musicians were wearing the regulation uniform with crab-red facings and white shoulder straps. The remainder, still wearing their old uniforms, were grouped on the left wing of each Battalion, in the second rank.

Tenth Reserve Infantry Regiment

This Regiment was formed from Reserve Battalions of the First Silesian Regiment, and the officers and cadre wore its uniform (yellow facings with white shoulder straps). The remainder wore grey caps with a yellow band, tailless jackets with yellow collar patches, yellow metal buttons, grey shoulder straps with white bands across them, grey trousers, and black gaiters. The cartridge box had a black belt. Later, covered Prussian shakos were issued, with calfskin packs (with white straps), grey haversacks, and grey greatcoats, carried bandolier fashion. The I Battalion retained the grey colour of their jackets, shoulder straps and trousers, but these were dyed dark blue in the II Battalion and very dark grey, almost black in the III.

On March 25 1815, this Regiment became the First Rhineland Regiment and by June the majority of the men and all the officers, NCOs and musicians were wearing the regulation uniform with crab-red facings and white shoulder straps. The remainder, still wearing their old uniforms, were grouped on the left wing of each Battalion, in the second rank.

Source Napoleon series.

Thanks dam0409, in Dr. Summerfield books the illustration of this regiment is clear and the tailles jacket have two row of buttons as per regular rgt, so simply cutting the tails of Perry prussian is possible to correctly reproduce that uniform, clearly I need to anticipate a little bit the covered shako introduction.
Thanks again

This article in the Napoleon series contains many errors, if you compare it with info from the regimental history:

First and second battalion blue or gray tailless jackets with two rows of buttons. At the front end of the collar a 4 Zoll (ca. 10 cm) long yellow patch. Third battalion the same, with black jackets. Some jackets had red collars, the men wearing them were grouped on the left wing of the second rank shortyl after 1st July 1813 (!), when the regiment was formed.

Slowly, the regiment aquired blue coats with yellow collars and white shouder straps, which already were worn by the cadres (offciers and NCOs) from the beginning.

As late as 1815, all men had black leather belts and the regulation uniforms. Probably in time for the 1815 campaign, it put on the new red distinctions and white shoulder straps ordered in March 1815. At least many other regiments did.

The 10. Reserve-Regiment was named 22. Infanterie-Regiment on 25 March 1815, and 22. Infanterie-Regiment (3. Schlesisches ) in November 1816. It never had a denomination as a Rhineland regiment.

Oliver, did the "all black leather belts" situation stem from 1813? Or were the belts ordered in 1814-15?

The 1884 regimental history states (p. 420) that a regimental order of 25 December 1813 had all belts being dyed black. Before, they had been partly black, partly white and only those of the third battalion completely black. At some time after the campaign (which one, 1814 or 1815, isn't stated), the two first battalions received white belts.

My initial statement that they all had black belts in 1815 was taken from Richard Knötels's excerpt from the regimental history, and seems to be his interpretation (he only gives the regimental history as his source).

The regiment received its colours on 3 October 1815, in the French fortress Givet.

If you want a flag, soem reserve infantry units carried non-regualtion flags like the Landwehr, so you ould get away with a Silesian one if you like!

I never came accross any reference to reserve regiments carrying non-regulation flags. Do you have a source ?

Neither the Landwehr nur the Reserve Regiments did carry non regulation colours.

Some Landwehrunits received colours from their home tome, but it was forbidden to carry them in the field.
I read form one Landwehr unit, that the colour was carried on the baggage waggon and when returning home it was worn on the victory parade entering the home town – once and only.

So – one can either stick to history and don't do colours for Reserve and Landwehr infantry – or in case one likes to have fantasy, use the fantasy.

Thank you Oliver Schmidt for the interesting informations about the 10. Prussin RIR

Reserve Infantry Regiments did not carry flags. Only in Sept-Nov 1815 when they were Infantry Regiments were they presented flags. This is clearly stated or I thought it was in my book.
Stephen

Oliver, another interesting point you mentioned – The use of the new "one colour fits all" red collars and cuffs in the Waterloo campaign.

Most wargamers use the older provincial colours for the 1815 campaign. Is there evidence of a number of regts having changed to the new red facings before June?

The red collars and cuffs for all line and Landwehr infantry throughout were introduced as late as 25 March 1817.

When on 25 March 1815 the new infantry regiments numbering from 13 to 32 were formed, they partly received new distinctions (by the combination of eight different colours for collars and cuffs, and four colours for shoulder straps, for all the 32 regiments).

A table can be seen in my Osprey Warrior, plate H. Probably, in one of Stephen's books as well.

Several regimental histories state that these new distinctions were put on the uniforms before the start of the 1815 campaign. Probably, this was the case with all regiments. But for lack of sources, for some regiments we will never get to know for sure.

Rats – I think I may have given my reserve infantry flags – Where are those clippers?

The facing colours were being changed for the campaign. When the regiments arrived in Paris or very soon after they received their nice new uniforms. The officers and new drafts would have had the new uniform first. Great attempts for uniformity was made with companies and even battalions.
Stephen