"Are you influenced by rule set names?" Topic

Seeing the topic about Sappy Nappy and a parallel discussion elsewhere, i was wondering if the name of rule sets influences, or has influenced, you buying decision?

Have you ever been pleasantly surprised and proved wrong?

From what I've read 'Panty Explosion' doesn't sound half bad… but still… that name. Also, it doesn't give you much idea what the game is about, the same goes for 'I Ain't Been Shot Mum!'… for some reason I thought that was a Western game with cowboys and shootouts.

I downloaded "High Seas Drifter" on the strength of its name, but found it to be a pretty straightforward set of naval rules. The author (whose name escapes me) likes to name his rule sets after Spaghetti Westerns.

Ron

Yes, I am. IABSM and Fanticide immediately spring to mind.

The silly names of Too Fat Lardies rules has never prevented me from buying their rules, but I wouldn't say it has made it any easier to get my game buddies to try them.

Yes, very much.

I should add that at least the names of the TFL rules are a bit distinctive. I don't get too inspired by yet another WW2 game that follows the "______ of ______" naming convention:

Flames of War
Wings of War
Call of Duty
Company of Heroes
Medal of Honor

Yes the name did put me off a bit. The cover design did more though – the abstract artwork.

I welcome some of the more unusual or memorable names. I'm a little worn out on games with the words: Thunder, Eagles, Glory, Legacy, or Destiny, plus some pidjin French or German.

Par example:

Legacy of the Thunder Eagles of Glory de l'Empereur!

-or worse yet, when they have a spelling error, such as:

Achtung Thunder Panzer Feldmarshall [sic]

Yes … names are often indicative of the audience being targeted … So although I'll try anything on a recommendation or from an author I know, otherwise I'm happy to assume that if I don't 'get it' that's because it is being targeted at a different audience.

Phil

Yes, makes it hard to take some seriously.

Names never put me off.
And odd named games I seem to buy the most of…

I have a dream of launching an excessively numerous collection of shabby rules all named "Flames of ____"

But no, names don't influence me. I buy them all, regardless. I'm kinda hopeless that way.

Beats the hell out fo the old titles from the 70s and 80s: War Games Rules. Wow, some marketing.

The TFL rules are great, but the names go from silly to somewhat offensive.

There's one that when used as an acronym is a vulgar word for a woman's private parts and they're coming out with a new one that's slang for a man's. Today on their Yahoo group I saw a post with a title that was combining the two. It's the sort of humor enjoyed by 12 year olds.

It might catch my attention but I wait for the buzz at convetions or now mostly online.
VR
James Mattes

The "Song of…" rules turn me off with their titles. That and the juvenile cartoon art.

Speaking of rules form the 70s and 90s… Avoid anything labeled "Fast Play".

Names do influence me. I have a hard time getting excited about any game whose name I'd feel silly saying out loud. In some cases, (Tigers & Stalins, which turned out to be a gem) I'll pick up a game just based on a cool name, but generally it works the other way.

I'm sure TFL games are great, but I'm not likely to ever know unless I happen on a convention game.

DBA is probably the only game with a goofy name I do play, and I never refer to it by its full name.

Whoa! Hold on. We are currently working on a set of rules called Chain of Command. That perfectly describes several area of the game, the pre-game scouting phase involves a chain sequence, the game itself revolves around using your chain of command to get things done. Chain of Command is a standard military phrase used by every armed force in the world.

Yes, some people have picked up on the initials being CoC and if they want to have a giigle at that then I am not bothered, but the rules are called Chain of Command. I refer to them as CoC sometimes because it is easy shorthand, but I never add the 'K'.

Nobody seems to make the same connection with Call of Cthulu which shares the same initials. Nobody gets upset about Wings of Glory which I find potentially far more offensive.

Yes, some of our rules have "different names". I Ain't Been Shot Mum was a response to all the Panzeruberfuhrer titles which were prevalent when we first published and were. frankly, heading towards glorification of all things national socialist. IABSM take a very human view of the impact of the psychology of war on the men who fight, men are not just killed but they are downgraded by the experience of combat, hence the title was less "wargaming-nazi" and more "mug-of-tea-British-Tommy", if I am allowed to string that many words together. 8^D

Troops Weapons & Tactics has a title where the acronym is far more offensive (apparently) on your side of the pond than over here. To call someone a tw… here is to call them a bit of a wally Even the Prime Minister used it on a radio interview not so long ago saying (about the potential pitfalls of politicians tweeting) "too many tweets might make you a twa..". Which hopefully indicates how differently the phrase is considered.

Okay, Charlie Don't Surf could potentially be thought of as tongue in cheek, although it is a quote from what must be the most famour Vietnam film ever, as could Sharp Practice. Kiss Me Hardy is considered by some to be slightly odd, but it must be the most famous nautical quote ever and it certainly lets you know what the rules are for.

But let's consider Through the Mud & the Blood – motto of the Royal Tank Regiment, Dux Britanniarum – A Roman military title, Bag the Hun (the name of one of my father's RAF manuals) Le Feu Sacre – Napoleons much vaunted sacred flame, Kriegsspiel, If the Lord Spares Us – a quote from the author's Great Uncle's last letter home from the front in 1917. Not an ounce of humour in those.

So, in the round I think one could say that one or two of our rule sets have somewhat off the wall titles, whereas most have perfectly normal ones which would pass muster from any wargaming publisher.

Offensive? One, but unintentionally so and then only if you live in a certain part of the world. Someone did suggest that our ACW supplement for Sharp Practice should be called "Confederacy, Union, National Tragedy". I dismissed the idea flat. It would have been downright offensive and I was not interested in that. We called it Terrible Sharp Sword, an obvious reference combined with Sharp from the rules original title.

I do get told that defending myself on this subject is a no win situation; I look bad if I do, I look bad if I don't. But it's 0400, I've been working all night and there are times when one needs to shout up.

Cheers

Rich

Well said Rich!

Somehow I was able to play Full Thrust for a couple years before I realized the titter-potential of its name… which I take to be completely unintentional.

The 'Song of…' game titles appeal to me because the name reflects a certain innocence I associate with those rules (and their art).

Yea, Full Thrust, i was a teenager at the time….

Yea, Full Thrust, i was a teenager at the time…

That reminds me of when I was in elementary school. There was a 'map of fairyland' on one of the hallway walls and my friends and I could get endless snickers out of one bit labeled 'The Bottomless Pit'… cuz… y'know… IT ISN'T WEARING ANY PANTS!!! HORK!

Have to admit that "Contemptible Little Armies" always appealed to me, but haven't looked under the hood yet.

As the creator of Generic Outlandishly Big Spacefleets! (G.O.B.S.!), I'm hardly one to talk. But the point was to convey the idea that the game is intended for "gobs" of spaceships. I even chose the acronym before deciding what title the letters would signify. Granted, it's not the sexiest name in the world, and if it were a commercial title I'd probably go with something more evocative and warlike.

As for my own purchases, I probably wouldn't buy "Panty Explosion," even if I were interested in the anime/manga genre, because, yes, I do consider that name to be in very poor taste, if not outright offensive. I also consider "Fantacide" to be an absolutely dreadful name (though not offensive). And I shy away from games that appear to have names built around nihilism, gore or the denigration of religion. Really dumb names that don't seem to have any relevance to the theme of the game also turn me off (like the "Get Some!" titles that someone was promoting here for a while. What an absolutely ridiculous and inexplicable name for a fantasy rules set.)

Still, if the reviews were good, I might overlook a less-than-perfect game name. Play is more important than titles, after all.

If Too Fat Lardies stopped punning or having comedy references in their titles I'd be disappointed! I'm not sure why IABSM stops people from trying the game…the only theory I have is that the title, to them, might indicate a frivolous game…it certainly isn't!

Two types of game title puts me off: WW2 rules with "Panzer" in it and Napoleonic rules with "Napoleon" in the title. Why? Because sometimes that indicates the prejudice of the designers in favouring a particular nation. So many "Panzer_______" sets of rules are biased towards the German armies and the same can be said of "Napoleon_____" with the French.

As for the comment about twelve year olds, all I can say isn't that the age when a large number of us come into wargaming?

If so, what is wrong with targeting twelve year old? Sorry, just realized I've accidentally set off a GW bomb here. I shall go away now and laugh maniacally in the darkness. The world is mine I tell you. :-)

Hmmm…

To answer the original question first. An unknown but interesting title may make me pick up a set of rules from a rack to have a look.

As regards the Lardies titles. I think they are witty and distinctive. Plus they generally give you a good idea of what the rules are all about. I've never found any of them offensive, but then I still like 'Carry On' films! Maybe some words don't travel well?

The name of a rules set would never stop me from looking at it and finding out what's inside. What's the old saying about a book and it's cover…?

Not generally, but there is one set of rules that I won't play because I find the title disrespectful towards the men and women who serve in the armed forces. I don't know, call me shallow.

And on another note: so I take it you guys are saying that "Achtung Flames of Napoleon's Panzers" won't be a good name for my next game?

I have to confess that I bought a copy of "Two up and bags of smoke" just because of the title.

All the best,

John.

What's in a Name? link

Al | ravenfeastsmeadhall.blogspot.com

The Good:

"The Sword and the Flame" – One can't go wrong with Kipling, especially for Colonials.
"I Ain't Been Shot, Mum" – Still makes me chuckle, yet there's an underlying grimness to it.

The Bad:

"Troops, Weapons & Tactics" – If I din't get the pun I would find it a bland title. Cultural differences aside, it should be renamed "Tactics, Weapons & Troops" to avoid offending gamers' sensibilities.
"Song of Things & Other Things" – Calls to mind Ren Faire madrigals about someone's Dungeons & Dragons game. Not for nothing was "Game of Thrones" re-named from its original title.

The Ugly:

"Panty Explosion" – seriously, what on Earth were they thinking? It could just as well have been named "Manga Explosion", which is much clearer as to its theme without being remotely as skeevy.

I could go on, but everyone has his or her own opinions on the matter; maybe we should just have a contest for "Best & Worst Game Titles EVAR".

Ron

@Sundance: Fantastic idea and a great way to get FOW gamers to play with Napoleonic era soldiers. Somebody's gonna make a fortune.

I am a huge fan of Napoleonic naval gaming, and I enjoy Too Fat Lardies' rule set Kiss Me Hardy, but I sure do wish it had a better name. Every time I try to introduce new people to it at the club they make skeptical remarks about the title. I don't run into many people familiar with the quote.

The examples in the rulebook feature the adventures of "Hugh Jarce". And in the scenarios offered on their Yahoo groups page, commander names are of the nature of "Felatio Lawnmower" and so on.

It's their company, their tastes, and nobody is forced to play of course. I just find it off-putting and wish they wouldn't try so hard for chuckles.

That said, I did read Rich's post above, and it's clear that many of their titles are pun- and innuendo-free.

James

Yes.

I like to make fun of the Ken Burns Civil war epic. (I may be the only American who dislikes it. )
Cue the banjo music, show a period daguerrotype of a far too young soldier, and hear "Ma, them Rebels shot me in the belly, and I died the next day."
The grave narrator intones "Private William Cook, Third Rhode Island."

That is what "I Ain't Been Shot, Mum!" always reminds me of.

To be totally contradictory, the title does not strike me as "serious", so I passed on it. Yet, I hate "serious" games. Go figure.

IIRC, Brigadier Peter Young commented that war was 'ninety nine per cent boredom and one per cent sheer terror' – or something very similar.

Somehow, I don't think Ninety Nine Per Cent Boredom would be a very successful title for a set of wargame rules – though I can recall some rules for which it would have been extremely appropriate!

John, I hear what you're saying about Ken Burns documentaries. His other standard is "Sherman led 30,000 men into the Shenandoah Valley…and they diiiiied." in that droning voice.

However, I would recommend putting IABSM's title to one side and give the game a try because it is impressive as a game.

"I'm a proper general, its NOT playing with toy soldiers, this is highly serious…"

TMP link

I win.

"Mein Panzer" has to be one of the worst names for a set of rules ever.

While it's unlikely that I'd go out of my way to choose a game because of it's great title, I definitely will pass up a game with a title that I consider stupid.

I thought it was a great shame that Two Fat Lardies went for Dux Britanniarum instead of Beerwulf…

I like the irreverent names.

Regards

I find it odd that one would play/not play a set of rules based on its name. Don't judge a book, etc… If I took a Ferrari 599 and put Kia badges on the rear, how many of you would refuse to drive it?

To me, and I did call my set of rules Snappy Nappy, the title should be memorable, with the subtitle explaining the gist of the rules. Thus, the SN subtitle reads: Simple, Subtle & Ultrafast Miniature Rules for the Napoleonic Era.

Yes, I knew the British slang, but Snappy Nappy was nicely alliterative and gave the right connotation of simplicity and flavor, not complexity.

I also chose a distinct cover:

to graphically emphasize that these rules were different from the usual Napoleonic rule sets.

Judging from the comments of folks who played the game, here on TMP, at HMGS conventions, reviewers, and on the Snappy Nappy Yahoo group, they liked the simplicity and flavor, and loved the idea that you can get a result in an evening. It's a snappy kind of game. :)

I wouldn't change the name. After all these years, it just continues to fit.

Russ

TRWNN?

Russ, I like both Snappy Nappy rules and title. In my experience, it is only those who have an uncritical adoration for the Corsican Tyrant who object to him being referred to as 'Nappy'.

Perhaps you might consider a Peninsular War variant named 'Give it some Welly'?

I will say that because of this discussion and the one specifically about Snappy Nappy I decided to do a little more research into the rules and bought a copy of the rules. The name has never put me off – I just never had the impetus to buy them before this discussion. They might actually be the one rules set which gets me back into Napoleonics after 25 years.

I like to make fun of the Ken Burns Civil war epic. (I may be the only American who dislikes it. grin )
Cue the banjo music, show a period daguerrotype of a far too young soldier, and hear "Ma, them Rebels shot me in the belly, and I died the next day."
The grave narrator intones "Private William Cook, Third Rhode Island."

Same here John.

And now every documentarian is applying the same darn technique to every subject.

- cue period music

- show subject photo

- read quote while in character

- state name in somber tones

String together enough of these snippets to fill two hours and PBS will put you on Sunday night no matter the topic.

Next week: "Ken Burns' History of the Cheese Danish".

UC,

Two types of game title puts me off: WW2 rules with "Panzer" in it and Napoleonic rules with "Napoleon" in the title. Why? Because sometimes that indicates the prejudice of the designers in favouring a particular nation.

Oh do come on!

A rule set title should do two things:
a) Make the title of a rule set stand out and
b) Link it to the period in the minds of the majority.

Thus if you are writing WW2 rules – you will need to have a an easily recognisable LINK TO THE PERIOD – so that's either "WW2" or funnily enough perhaps "Panzer" – as panzer is intrinsically linked to WW2 to many. Thus you've made your link.

It has nothing to do with the prejudice of a designer.

DB

I think I am influenced. I know people were influenced by the name I picked for Gruntz 15mm. I had several customers say they almost did not buy it because I had used a Z in the title. So I think a name can certainly influence player interest and I may have turned off a certain market due to the title.