"Interesting numbers for a project using TFM process " Topic

So, Impact is a well run, very helpful, friendly business making a niche product – Fantasy Football models (Blood Bowl and Elfball).

Despite going as low as they can with their prices (and the owner does communicate a lot about profitability and how long it takes to make the money back on projects, even while embracing kickstarter as much as they can) they still faced the problem that their teams weighed in at typically £50.00 GBP+. Which in some cases was more expensive than GW (which can only be explained by the fact GW has forgot their blood bowl range so don't keep raising the prices :) ) and a lot of this cost is metal (doesn't help the shipping either).

Anyway as a spin off from another project they have managed to get time in Troll Forged Miniatures busy schedule to get some of their teams converted from metal to the plasticy stuff TFM is using. And the price drop is startling – $35 USD (roughly £23.00 GBP for the sinking £ I believe) for a team.

The conversion cost is apparently 95% less than making a new team so they see the chance to convert their most popular lines as too good to miss.

Given all that I wonder if other company's out their with existing masters for popular lines would want to convert?Would seem to be another nail in the coffin for metal models, thinking as I am of Foundries latest newsletter where they talk about the cost of making some of the old fantasy packs.

Original thread details here
link

Comparison pic post here
link

Impact shop
impactminiatures.com

Looks like you have to be a forum member to see the links.

I guess I will never know…

Troll Forge is onto something. I know I'd be looking into it if I produced miniatures.

What we need to do is take all our collective piles of unpainted miniatures and flood the market with scrap pewter. That would reduce the price and make a lot of wives very happy. Till they realized that their husbands are just making room for new stuff :)

Didn't realise you had to be a member – the link is just to a long 6 page thread where they talk about the business decisions, new product, plans for future, open invitation to the other fantasy football manufactures to jump on board, the schedules involved etc and then one of the first chaps to get the new models has a few comparison pics – nothing new if you have seen the troll forged stuff already and if not check out the troll forge thread on TMP. I've told you enough to get the idea in the first post I hope – if I can ever work out how to put pics on tmp I'll steal them from the comparison shots.

I concur on going with this stuff from the get go for any new manufacturer. My concerns would be the initial start cost – the numbers here are for taking existing masters and getting moulds from them. I'm sure the cost is comparable but I would be unsurprised if the moulds were a little different to metal casting. But more importantly the time.

TFM has a winner on its hands – I haven't played with the material but friends that have say it is head and shoulders above the competitors – GW Failcast, Reaper Toybones and Mantic and co restic (I have a load from the dreadball kickstarter – I am not happy). But they understandably are going to want to maximise on their time put into development and seem to have a lot of unmet demand from people who would like to work with them. Whether they get enough to make it worth expanding sustainably is the bottleneck.

I don't know what their plans are but if I was them, I wouldn't be casting figs. I'd be selling material and machines. It's good to run the existing machines so that the word gets out. Depends on the machine cost. I thought I saw a $5 USDK price tag to convert a spin caster over to plastic. I think it needs a mixing/injection system.

At that price point, you can get a cheaper injection mold like Proxie Models. However, the mold costs are better in the long run.

I bet the price to start from scratch and to convert is about the same. You still have your master sculpting costs.

I had forgotten all about Proxie Models, a friend got his bases produced through them…
proxiemodels.blogspot.com if anyone like me wants to check out where one mans frontier spirit has led him! (Think I last had a look when he was putting videos up of how to magically make ruin sprues!)
I am very surprised though he is getting the moulds done that cheaply, I was under the impression that a spin caster – even converted – would be cheaper unless you were looking at runs in the thousand.
Yes we don't know there plans and to be frank half the time in the wargames industry people have different criteria to what you would expect for decision making…

>>>>>>.
I bet the price to start from scratch and to convert is about the same. You still have your master sculpting costs.
>>>>>>>.
I would have thought the base cost (masters) was the same, but with potentially variable costs for the moulds as I confess I know nothing about that, for all I know they are identical and only the spin casting machine has to be different.

Ken (Proxie Models) gets his molds cheap because he makes them himself. He has to do all the design work and cut it on a small cnc machine. I think the first few where before he even got the cnc. He just milled them by hand.

From checking over his blog I see the second hand hardware is as fun as ever – still surprised though he is managing to be so cheap.

You can buy a Pallet of plastic injection pellets for rather cheap. His has automated feed and ejection of the sprue. So push go and it cranks out 100 parts in less time then it takes to fill and empty a spin cast mold. The bigger problem is getting the molds made and that learning curve is rather steep. He is doing a great job.

link

I posted this on the blog too. This book is a great reference for people looking into the how to aspect ot injection molding.

Thanks for the kind words about my odd hobby/business. I am making it work somehow.