"Irish bagpipes of the Napoleonic/ War of 1812? " Topic

According to the book "The Final Invasion" the 88th Connaught Rangers entered the battle of Plattsburg, 1814, to the sound of bagpipes! Did the Irish regiments of the British army have bagpipers, official or otherwise, during the Napoleonic/War of 1812 period?

Officially no. Only Highlanders had pipers on strength.

Unofficially yes. Irish and English units could have pipers. Sometimes just a soldier who could pipe, others musicians employed by the C.O because he likes the sound.

The 29th (or 20th) had a piper killed in action. The C.O was quite cut up about it I beleive. Staffordshire, Northumberland, Lincolnshire all unique pipes that persisted until industrialisation and urban dancehall killed off alot of English folk customs. It was only really the Great Highland Pipes that were official, low landers were more fifers.

However, I wouldn't recommend overstating how many English andvIrish units had unofficial pipers. 88th and the 29th are the only two noted examples do I assume the practice existed but was not widespread.

The pipes werre not specifically Scottish there are I believe several English varieties (some still exist, others are only known from writing) and there are a couple of Irish styles as well as Roman, Iranian and Breton types.

Thank you. Any idea if the pipers would wear the same uniform as the other ranks or uniforms like the drummers? Reversed colours?
Now how am I going into convert figures in pipers in 15mm?

I believe the Bretons and Irish both adopted the Scottish pipes (in addition to their own) for outdoor use because of their volume, so I suspect any pipes used by English/Irish regiments would have been of the Scottish variety.

Where Scottish pipes have been adopted I note there is a general tendency to imitate Scottish dress as well: link

If a musician is just a soldier pressed into that role then I'd guess he'd just have his regular uniform.

If privately hired the c.o might furnish him or them in official reversed clothing, but maybe not. I believe in most units reversed jackets were usually for company drummers.

The piper for the 29th was a Scot hired to be the battalions piper. C.Os choice. So I'd assume that he would use his own Highland pipes. However if the piper was Irish or English he might use a local pipe he's familiar with. By all accounts the Staffordshire or Lincolnshire pipes (I forget which) were quite large. Unfortunately what they sounded like has been lost. It would be safe to assume that most pipers would be Scotsmen, but not all. The piping tradition was still strong in North East England so a few of them would pop up. If he was English or Irish its unlikely he would be willing to "kilt up".

I'd say you'd have room for artistic licence. I've often thought of proving one piper for one of my 3rd divisions English or Irish units using victrix parts.

It should be noted that at that time, while the highlanders were associated with bag pipes, bagpipes were not as strongly identified as being solely a Scottish thing piping being pretty much just as popular in England,Ireland parts of France. Their maybe some other continental types as well of varying pitch and drone.

There are pipes all over Central and Eastern Europe too – I know of Czech and Slovak dudy, Romanian Vlach pipes, and I think there are Serb and Croat versions as well. As doctorphalanx points out – the Scots pipes tend to be louder.

Personally, I can't stand the sound of any of them, which probably stems from having a housemate at uni teaching himself to play them at 6 a.m. every morning.

Here is a good link on the warpipes. Lots of military mentions.

link

It makes the point that the Irish and Scots warpipes are pretty much the same instrument. It would be a brave man who claimed to know in which country they originated. They are though a Gaelic martial instrument.

There are loads of pipes but for volume the warpipes do stand out.

I like pipe music and have heard it in Brittainy, Spain and Northumbria as well as Scotland and Ireland. The small pipes though would be lost and awkward on the battlefield.

Ottoman Turkish armies were noted to have pipers, at least into the 15th and 16th centuries. They were noted to have been in the official procession into Constantinople after its fall. Presumedly this Ottoman tradition is where the Balkan tradition of pipers would have originated.

Coming back to uniforms, my understanding is that even in Highland units, the pipers wore regular dress, only drummers having reversed colours. This would seem to apply even more to unofficial pipers in other regiments.

Funny you should mention…

There was a Northumbrian piper busking in the town centre today as I wandered to Tyneside wargames club for my ration of mayhem.

Very agreeable, too.

Very interesting Edwulf – many thanks

There is a scana in "Napoleon" where a Regiment from Brittany marches into town led by Pipers. Also, Galicia in Spain is known for it's pipers.

The Irish gave the bagpipes to the Scots as a joke, but the Scots haven't seen the joke yet.
Oliver Herford (American Writer, 1863-1935)

Scots ARE Irish! The inhabitants of Scotland before the Scots played the Carnyx!

Bagpipes are a psychological weapon!

I do not buy the idea that the Turks introduced bagpipes to the Balkans. I think some version of the bagpipe is a really ancient instrument, and it is probably futile to try to figure out where it first appeared, but it was likely near universal in medieval Europe. I once noted a bagpiper playing at a Flemish peasant dance in a painting from the early Renaissance period. One of my first uniform reference books is Preben Kannik's "Military Uniforms of the World in Color" (New York City: The Macmillan Co., 1968)--hardcover for $4.95 USD! Plate 58 illustrates a piper of the Polish Foot Guards from 1732 playing a version of the bagpipes that seems to include most of a goat, from head and horns to dangling leg and hoof!

The general consensus is earliest examples are found in Iran. Spread to the west by Rome. Not heard about Turks before.