"Combat Action Command Rules!" Topic

I would love to go to On Military Matters and take part in the CAC tournament; sadly, some idiot has put a large ocean between me and it:(.

I appreciate everyone's comments and feedback. There are AAR's on the CAC website and some have also been published in Miniature Wargames magazine. There is useful information on play mechanics in my BLOG on the website. There is also a link to email me directly with your questions. While reading other gamers' comments is a good way to get a feel for a new set of rules, perhaps the best way is to "test drive" them for yourself. That is why I have put various free downloads of demo versions of the rules on the website. Try it and draw your own conclusions. The current free download is Vietnam, but the rule mechanics are just the same as for WWII and the data cards also work the same.

Enjoy! Lee

Hi Lee

Any time scales on early war cards coming out, or modern ones.

Mark

Lee:

I appreciate you spirited defense of your rule mechnisms but Mobius is right get the Encyclopia of German Armor he mentioned – its a great source and consistent (when using multipe sources you can never be sure your getting apples to apples – as an example Western sources give penetration data assuming a to hit angle of 30 degrees – Russian data assumes 0 degrees).

Also FOW data isn't that good – do not depend on it.

You should have stuck to your guns re d20 v. d6 most of the complexity in your system seems to come from needing to roll multiple d6s. Playtesters sometimes balk at new ideas out side their comfort zone and many have FOW backgrounds. Its up to designers to break the mold (d10 for instance don't require double digit arthimatic but have a better 'range' than d6).

TomT

Mark, is there a specific theater in early war that interests you or your gaming group?

We are trying to understand the interest level for modern and whether that would be focused on Nam or Iraq and Afghanistan.

Any feedback you or others care to provide will help us target the next cards better!

To recap, there are now "cards" for WWII Northwest Europe 1944-45; Eastern Front 1942-43 and Pacific, The Solomons 1942-43.

As always, thank you for your feedback. Lee – the author.

Thomas Thomas. Like that name, my middle name is Thomas lol.

Good comments. I know there are significant differences between sources, which is why I tried to "double check" information by using multiple sources. However as you point out that can also lead to pitfalls. On balance, I feel CAC has good (accurate) armor values compared to some other systems such as FoW. But it's not perfect. No system is perfect.

As for rolling multiple d6 instead of 1d10 or 1d20, the d6 choice was hotly debated during development. Why did d6 win out? The area where we play tested CAC was very BIG on GW gaming and majority opinion was that gamers would prefer (and some actually even liked) rolling multiple d6 as opposed to a d10, or d20. Multiple d6 rolls were retained (we could have made it a single roll like FoW) because we wanted the larger "distribution" of roll results.

The d6 system is really not complex (even with having to add up two or three d6) the true "complexity" comes from gamers having to figure out whether to "CAC or not to CAC".

In all of the large Tank battles I have played, the d6 rolls actually play fast and easy. It's the decision making that takes the time and adds a level of complexity similar to chess – learning the moves is simple, learning to make the the right move is a challenge.

Thanks for your feedback! Lee – the author

PS – I have and used the German Armor book Mobius mentioned as one of my sources.

Hi Lee

The theater of intrest is 39/40 Poland and france also western desert 40/41. As for the mordern period looking at Iraq and Africa to use with our modern figure range.

Mark

Mark, do you have a link for your modern figure range? Lee

Hi Lee

Here is our web address, we will be bring out some modern brits soon to go with the rest of the range.

mutineer-miniatures.org.uk

mark

Mark, I would be interested in doing a free CAC download of the LITE rules and a Scenario for Modern that people could use your minis to play. Please contact me directly via the email author link on the CAC website. Thanks! Lee

For those of you living in the New York City – Philly – Washington DC area of the US who are interested in trying CAC, I will be running Demo Games at The Warstore Weekend on Saturday 10/27 at 1pm and at HMGS Fall-In on Friday 11/2 (1pm Kursk) and Saturday 11/3 (10am Guadalcanal). Rules will be taught and minis provided – all you need to do is show up and play. Please see The Warstore Weekend and HMGS Fall-In websites for more information, directions, etc.

Cheers! Lee

Tim, you're cruel.

The genesis of Combat Action Command. Many have asked if I created CAC because I didn't like FoW. No. Actually the story is quite different. I have been an avid gamer for over 50 years and owned a hobby game store and miniatures business back in the 80's when Dungeons and Dragons was the rage and GW was in its infancy. It was also the age of the Rambo and Platoon series of movies. I used to travel to all of the major cons to sell my D&D miniatures, but because I wanted to play WWII I made a set of HO scale (20mm) rules based on the Rambo movies which used plastic figures and Rocco Minitanks. I called it NAM-RPG which stood for Nam the Role Playing Game ( a bad pun I know). I would run standing room only games that competed well with D&D because it was something new and different. Some friends asked if I could take out the role-playing part and just make WWII rules, which led to WWII-SMG, WWII the Skirmish Miniatures Game. Calm down. Before everyone gets bent out of shape about using TMP for advertising, you can't, and never could, buy either NAM-RPG or WWII-SMG. They were simply rules, charts and tables I would drag around to cons and stores to play Nam and WWII with groups of gamers. Long after I closed my shop, we still gamed at local stores. I remember one fall when we played Kampfgruppe Peiper in one to one scale using Minitanks (yes I can still field the KG 1-1 lol) on four gaming tables lined up end to end. We'd play every Saturday until 4 or 5 in the morning on Sunday. Great fun. This was about the time FoW was just getting started in the US and BF's minis were very nice, affordable (back then lol) and much easier to lay your hands on than Rocco Minitanks. So my friends asked me if I could convert WWII-SMG into something they could play with their FoW minis. Obviously converting platoon level 20mm rules into company level 15mm rules took some doing, and several years of play testing and fiddling. The end result was Combat Action Command which is much different mechanically than WWII-SMG was (for one its company level and no longer skirmish level), but at least CAC managed to capture the play intensity and "feel" of SMG while using FoW minis. So now you know.
.
Cheers! Lee

He just keeps going…and going…and going…

Well Lee I wish you every success with this…and I'd imagine everyone does….deep down…no deeper than that… Unfortunately the nature of your initial postings have probably caused some damage to your rep (at least that was my impression) and since there's no real objective definitive science to back it up newly developed war-gaming rules your average war gamer is often relying on the developers reputation or rave reviews or unfortunately more often than not: clever marketing. Or in your case Lee we at the very least need a favourable sense of credibility. Whether entirely your fault or not Lee first impression on the site was probably not what it should have been. But over time at least my opinion is that you seem to be very well read and have given this endeavour a great deal of thought and research…(much more than I initially presumed…) I'm up to my eyeballs in rules at the moment but I would like to try CAC out some time.. but it would be nice to read a few independent reviews from someone… Anyways Lee I wish you all the best in the future….

John

If I may join the discussion here. I see little difference to Lee's post than Rob at Scarab posting about his minis, or Piers informing us if the progress of Kursk etc, or the myriad of other people posting on here about their own product. Having read back through the various posts any issues of 'credibility' would come more down to lack of insight as to Lee's original intent in posting, and that's to inform a wider audience about his game. having written a WWII (and others) games myself I can really see the appeal of this. Keep up the work and developments with CAC Lee, I haven't played it but that's not the point! Oh, and thanks for the informative posting in the other thread too!

Ark

Grey Panda – thank you for your best wishes. Being new to TMP I have learned very quickly that it is much easier to offend than inform. Which is a shame because many people here have much to offer. I have found a lot of good information shared here.

Ark3nubis – always happy to help if I can. Feel free to ask more questions and best of luck with your rules. Let me know if you can use any play testers!

Cheers!

Lee

Yeah will do Lee, thank god for the Internet in that case though as being the other side of the pond to you would make that a bit more tricksy otherwise. I might take you up on that in some distant future, cheers again,

Ark

You're welcome Lee…but I seriously meant it. I've enjoyed your contributions (even the initial soap operatic discussions…) and I can't help but admire anyone who writes their own set of rules and has them published (I've wrote lots but all they deserve is the bin (or trash can…) All the best…

John

Need your help.

People who are playing CAC – Pacific are asking where to get US Marines, Japanese, etc. in 15mm and other scales.

I know Old Glory makes them, and that FoW-BF does not (yet). People have told me "Peter Pig" makes a line.

If you know of good quality lines of 10-12-15-20mm minis for The Pacific – please post links here for them.

Thank you!

Lee (the author)

Eureka USA has them also. They also have sailors, which are perfect for the SeaBees…

eurekaminusa.com

Here's the link for Peter Pig.

(if in the UK) peterpig.co.uk

(if in the USA) brookhursthobbies.com

Bill

If you want 10mm then Pendraken do some nice kit…

link

Thanks for your help!

I actually have played my CAC NAM scenarios using 10mm. Hands down, the scale/distances look and feel much better in 10mm than they do in 15mm. If I hadnt had sooo many FoW minis, I probably would have gone with 10mm from the start.

Pendraken makes some very nice minis and I am talking with them to see if they will make "Platoon Packs" (like FoW does for their Infantry) for CAC Pacific. Keep you posted.

Interestingly, the fastest way to get FoW/BF to do The Pacific is probably for someone else to start marketing to that niche. So I may be helping out all the FoW gamers lol.

Cheers!

Lee

In response to requests for a Combat Action Command forum, I have created the following Yahoo Group with open membership:

link

Please use it for feedback, questions and comments. Hopefully this will serve the needs of the expanding group of CAC gamers. As this is an open group, I would ask that you be respectful with your comments.

If you feel the need to make "colorful comments" then please email me directly from the CAC website!

Cheers!
Lee

A comment? A factoid. Malwarebytes my malware checker blocks the CAC website because it comntains a malware threat. As a possible buyer, this makes me wonder.

OMM says there are are more details and scenarios on the website. So what? For once OMM has something besides a picture.

Oh boy, a yahoo site. with 11 members and no discussion later than here.

I had actually forgotten about about CAC till now…early discussion was interesting. I didn't think the website was still around. I never did see an independent review in the end…and doesn't look like I ever will now

Shame, I think Lee has put in a huge personal investment (as do many others with their games) into it. I downloaded the light intro rules and they seemed to do the job, seemed a little complicated but definitely eased up when I got more familiar as with any game. I actually really liked the way he has worked up the armour penetration rules (and explains in the earlier post in this thread), and yes, there maybe are similar/easier ways to achieve a similar outcome, but then other games are at a similar level of detail too. Definitely tried to create more of simulation than game, well done I say,

Cheers,

Ark

My question is why is this on the British Wargaming forum thread. It should be in WW2 – Rules

From what I know the CaC system is applicable to warfare from WWII onwards, although i think primarily developed with WWII in mind.

This post IS on the WWII ruies forum. You could equally ask why it is on the American board, maybe Lee was wanting to hit the main English speaking forums?