ochoin deach | 01 Apr 2011 11:03 p.m. PST |
Napoleonic, please. "Best" is of course subjective as I expect your nominations will be. Please state battle & offer reasons: For me, Qatre Bras. It has the invincible British. The battle includes woods, hills, urban areas & rivers. It involves significant but not unwieldy numbers from all arms. It has possibilities concerning re-enforcements & off-table manoeuvering. A fine battle to fight. |
Dark Knights And Bloody Dawns | 02 Apr 2011 1:57 a.m. PST |
Leipzig, a real challenge for both sides and diverse scenery. |
Connard Sage | 02 Apr 2011 2:17 a.m. PST |
Napoleonic, please. In that case wouldn't a better thread title have been 'Best Napoleonic battle for gaming?'? Because any second now some fool is going to come along and nominate Gaugemela. oh er um
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ochoin deach | 02 Apr 2011 2:32 a.m. PST |
CS, title was done & dusted before I worked that one out (&, as you know, you can't edit titles). I see my flaw & will now commit suppuku in supplication (sound of intestines hitting tiled floor). |
Connard Sage | 02 Apr 2011 2:34 a.m. PST |
Do you mind? I've only just had breakfast :( |
ochoin deach | 02 Apr 2011 2:38 a.m. PST |
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Connard Sage | 02 Apr 2011 2:46 a.m. PST |
Bacon, eggs, beans and pork sausage actually Bill can change the title, if you ask nicely. |
ochoin deach | 02 Apr 2011 3:03 a.m. PST |
"Bill can change the title, if you ask nicely." You know I am the epitome of courtesy. Few can withstand my charm. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Connard Sage | 02 Apr 2011 3:05 a.m. PST |
Compared to me, yes |
ochoin deach | 02 Apr 2011 3:43 a.m. PST |
Compared to you
..no. Too easy. 87) |
Gazzola | 02 Apr 2011 4:29 a.m. PST |
ochin deach There are so many but I suppose it might depend on which armies and campaigns you or the other players tend to favour. If you favour French and Austrians, I would suggest Rivoli because it was such an exciting action, but the terrain might be a pain. Wagram because it was an epic encounter between two old foes and you can include troops from Napoleon's allies. In terms of the Peninsular I would suggest Albuera 1811, because it involves British, French, Spanish and Portuguese troops and they all fought well. And I think the terrain wouldn't be too much of a problem either. |
freecloud | 02 Apr 2011 4:49 a.m. PST |
I think the "close run shows" are the most interesting, as I have Austrians it has to be the 1809 series. |
4th Cuirassier | 02 Apr 2011 5:10 a.m. PST |
Eylau. Carnage in the snow. Though a challenge in terms of troop numbers. |
Pictors Studio | 02 Apr 2011 5:18 a.m. PST |
Aboukir Bay. The sides are very easily manageable. It is a neat battle to use to demonstrate naval tactics of the period. Both sides have a chance of winning, especially when the French commander is a wargamer rather than a French admiral*. The set up is pretty easy but there is significant terrain for a naval game, it just happens to be underwater. Plus massive explosions are possible. *I say this not to disparage French naval officers but because there is a certain disconnect with the reality of the situation that would cause wargamers to be more aggressive than their actual historical counterparts. |
SECURITY MINISTER CRITTER | 02 Apr 2011 5:58 a.m. PST |
I've always been fond of Borodino. |
Femeng2 | 02 Apr 2011 6:23 a.m. PST |
Quatre-Bras and Waterloo. Both close run things with lots of possibilities – and you can make a campaign out of it! Suppose Sharp's (Colquin Grant's) message had gotten through. |
vojvoda | 02 Apr 2011 6:24 a.m. PST |
Wagram the first day, Borodino, and Echmulh. VR James Mattes |
21eRegt | 02 Apr 2011 6:26 a.m. PST |
If looking for a "small" battle with a variety of uniforms how about Castalla, 1813? Spanish, Italians (in British service), KGL, Brit line, Swiss, etc. against a French force under Suchet. 18,000 allied against 13,000 French. Allied Order of Battle Murray's army counted 17,080 infantry, 1,036 cavalry, and 30 guns. It consisted of two Anglo-Italian and two Spanish infantry divisions, plus Adam's brigade. The army was organized as follows. * Lieutenant-General John Murray, 8th Baronet o Anglo-Italian Division: General John Mackenzie + 1/27th Foot battalion + 4th King's German Legion (KGL) Line bttn + 6th KGL Line battalion + Sicilian Estero Regiment (2 bttns) o Anglo-Italian Division: General William Henry Clinton + 1/10th battalion + 1/58th battalion + 1/81st Foot battalion + 2nd Italian Regiment (1 bttn) + De Roll's Swiss Regiment (1 bttn) + Dillon's Swiss Regiment (1 bttn) o Independent Brigade: Colonel Frederick Adam + 2/27th Foot battalion + 1st Italian Regiment (1 bttn) + Calabrian Free Corps (1 bttn) + Light companies of 3rd and 8th KGL Line bttn + 20th Light Dragoon Regiment (2 squadrons) + Olivenca Regiment (2 squadrons) + Foreign Hussars (1 troop) o Spanish Division: Whittingham + Cordoba Infantry Regiment (1 bttn) + Mallorca Infantry Regiment (1 bttn) + Guadalajara Infantry Regiment (1 bttn) + 2/Burgos Infantry Regiment (1 bttn) + 2/Murcia Infantry Regiment (1 bttn) + 5th Grenadier battalion o Spanish Division: Roche + Aragon Volunteers (1 bttn) + Portuguese Volunteers (1 bttn) + Alicante Infantry Regiment + Chinchilla Infantry Regiment + Canarias Infantry Regiment French Order of Battle Suchet's force numbered 11,848 infantry, 1,424 cavalry, and 24 artillery pieces. The Army of Aragon and Valencia was organized as follows. * Marshal Louis Gabriel Suchet o 1st Division: General of Division Robert + 1st Light Infantry Regiment + 3rd Light Infantry Regiment + 114th Line Infantry Regiment + 121st Line Infantry Regiment o 2nd Division: General of Division Jean Isidore Harispe + 7th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) + 44th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) + 116th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) o 3rd Division: General of Division Pierre-Joseph Habert + 14th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) + 16th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) + 117th Line Infantry Regiment (2 bttns) o Cavalry Division: General of Division André Joseph Boussart + 24th Dragoon Regiment + 13th Cuirassier Regiment + 4th Hussar Regiment |
Saber6 | 02 Apr 2011 6:36 a.m. PST |
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spontoon | 02 Apr 2011 6:53 a.m. PST |
Lot's of nice small ones in the War of 1812. |
Prince Alberts Revenge | 02 Apr 2011 8:10 a.m. PST |
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quidveritas | 02 Apr 2011 9:32 a.m. PST |
Waterloo and Borodino Iconic set piece battles. Both require a lot of troops, a lot of time, and a lot of players. Either will be a lot of fun, create a lot of memories, and you will be well satisfied when you finish. Hard to pull either one off but you did say 'best'. |
sharps54 | 02 Apr 2011 9:37 a.m. PST |
This is a great question but it really needs to be broken down to what size battle/type you want to play. Best skirmish/raid, best big battle, best sea battle, etc. Jason Stafford, VA |
Oldenbarnevelt | 02 Apr 2011 10:00 a.m. PST |
As a 28mm gamer it is like asking which kind of poison fruit you prefer to eat? Answer: none of them. Now if that were the Renaissance
.. |
Der Alte Fritz | 02 Apr 2011 10:11 a.m. PST |
I like Austerlitz. You can easily break it down into three smaller battles, each of which is very different from the other. |
darthfozzywig | 02 Apr 2011 10:42 a.m. PST |
I second Connard Sage: Gaugemela. It's a pretty even fight and since Napoleon wasn't present it doesn't require special rules to account for him. |
UK John | 02 Apr 2011 12:30 p.m. PST |
Bagration 1944
. sorry that's not Napoleonic so I'd put forward Lodi as inspired by the superb model in Paris. |
Natholeon | 02 Apr 2011 2:08 p.m. PST |
Seconding Rivoli and Auerstadt. The first is tense, evenly balanced and requires quite a bit of manouevre. The other because you get to have Davout's super-troopers in action (who needs the Imperial Guard when you've got III Corps in 1806?). And if you get to play the Prussians, well, they look pretty
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JimSelzer | 02 Apr 2011 3:12 p.m. PST |
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Grand Duke Natokina | 02 Apr 2011 3:50 p.m. PST |
Lundy's Lane, 25 July 1814. The US and British in Ontario, Canada. Forces fairly even and small enough to be manageable on a wargame table. The American part of the Napoleonic Wars. Weaselhoffen. |
jammy four | 02 Apr 2011 4:02 p.m. PST |
Tolentino
the last throw of the dice for Murat and his remarkably colourfull army and the stalwart Austrians
.not such a foregone conclusion as ypu might think Ged gringo40s.com |
Feet up now | 03 Apr 2011 5:23 a.m. PST |
Always loved Hastings fairly even forces with different tactics for each.Not to complex unit and weapon wise,good enough to try it from both sides too.Thats the one I would pick for best historical. For Napoleonics Battle of Borodino ,for similar reasons. |
matthewgreen | 03 Apr 2011 8:38 a.m. PST |
Waterloo takes a lot of beating, and remains my favourite. Lots of interesting units, a tense battle fought on quite a compact battlefield. If you start the game early in the day you have to remember that a lot of the French forces hadn't reached the battlefield. If you don't want to play the Prussians, take Lobau's corps out of the French order of battle and set an endpoint of 6pm say; if Wellington survives he's won. Other than that Albuera makes an excellent game, and Talevera and Quatre Bras are good too. For battles without the British I would put in a word for Marengo 1800, playing the complete battle, including Napoleon's retreat, down the table. I have found Raab 1809 quite playable, though the French have an advantage. I have always wanted to try Auerstadt. |
TheWarStoreMan | 03 Apr 2011 12:29 p.m. PST |
The Waterloo refights I have seen/played in at cons have nearly always ended in French triumphs. The French mistakes of the day are seldom repeated and it is hard to do as well as the Duke. I vote for Quatre Bras. Fun troops, lots of what ifs. Neal |
matthewgreen | 03 Apr 2011 2:48 p.m. PST |
The limited number of refights I have done on Waterloo have been 50/50. You need to be careful on the scenario setup though so that it doesn't tilt things too much the French way – the initial deployment is very important, as well as the effects of the muddy ground in the morning, especially. Some of the French "mistakes" in fact reflect the difficulties they faced. Even if you think this is dodgy history, for game purposes its a good idea. |
Dasher | 04 Apr 2011 7:47 p.m. PST |
I have to go with Conrad Sage, here, the title leaves the voting wide open. Hence, my vote for Sekigahara. |