BarmyBob | 26 Feb 2011 7:15 p.m. PST |
Anyone recommend a good set of rules for this? I was actually thinking of using Fire and Fury for it, as I recently got hold of a LARGE quantity of 15mm stuff for dirt cheap. Just curious who's playing this period and what rules you're using. |
Extra Crispy | 26 Feb 2011 7:27 p.m. PST |
Some possibilities include: 1870 Volley & Bayonet: Road to Glory They Died for Glory Take a look here for details about these and more: link |
John Leahy | 26 Feb 2011 7:45 p.m. PST |
Field of Battle. Great set of rules. Thanks, John |
Blake Walker | 26 Feb 2011 8:02 p.m. PST |
When I had 15-mm FPW armies, I used They Died for Glory. Blake |
Dave Gamer | 26 Feb 2011 8:27 p.m. PST |
All of the above plus Chassepot & Needlegun. |
DestoFante | 26 Feb 2011 9:19 p.m. PST |
For something different, but very original with intriguing game mechanisms: "Repique: Zouave" by Bob Jones: link link |
BarmyBob | 26 Feb 2011 9:29 p.m. PST |
thank you gentlemen. I appreciate the input and will have a look at all of them. |
Saber6 | 26 Feb 2011 9:39 p.m. PST |
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Baccus 6mm | 27 Feb 2011 2:45 a.m. PST |
Polemos FPW rules. Gives you two levels of action, period specific rules system, army generators and scenarios. They are a 'top down' design so less hardware driven them some sets. |
parrskool | 27 Feb 2011 4:53 a.m. PST |
The Napoleonic version of F&F (Age of Eagles) has a yahoo group where you will find a FPW version to download in the files section. |
coopman | 27 Feb 2011 5:56 a.m. PST |
Larry Brom's "Bring Up the Guns" rules would work fine as well. I was a playtester for these and it was a lot of fun. |
Pedrobear | 27 Feb 2011 8:39 a.m. PST |
To the Last Gaiter Button. link Grid-based system written primarily for 10mm, but workable with 6 and 15. |
ezza123 | 27 Feb 2011 9:54 a.m. PST |
The Wyre Forest Wargames Club has a good have some good ideas and scenarios for using Fire and Fury for Franco-Prussian games; wfgamers.org.uk Ezza |
Red3584 | 27 Feb 2011 11:42 a.m. PST |
I've played several games using Black Powder which worked really well. There were some suggestions for French and Prussian stats at Last Hussar's excellent blog
link
there are also some ideas on the BP yahoo group. I've also looked at 'To the Last Gaiter Button'
not sure about the table top rules [similar on the surface anyway, to some of the Peter Pig square based rules] but would make an excellent campaign system. |
Dale Hurtt | 27 Feb 2011 9:49 p.m. PST |
If you want to get into tactical details, then To the Last Gaiter Button is probably not the choice to make. Or Polemos, or Chassepot & Needlegun, for that matter. They all play at a higher level, even if the units do represent battalions. (Although Polemos has a level where the unit is a Brigade, I believe.) So the first thing to ask yourself is: what does the basic unit represent? Second: what level do I, as the commander, want to play at? (Company, Battalion, Brigadier, Divisional Commander, Corps Commander, Army Commander?) THEN ask what rules are available, given those answers. Polemos, for example, uses one base to represent the unit (a la DBX), so if you have LOADS of figures, that might not be the way you want to go. There is a supplement (a TFL special, to be exact) for converting Sharp Practice over to the FPW. You can easily play 150 singly-based troops to a side using these rules. I am sure it would be great fun too. But at that level you are what, not even a Company commander? Dale |
Old Contemptibles | 27 Feb 2011 11:01 p.m. PST |
Been using "They Died For Glory" for years. Great set of rules. I had just finished basing some French and Bavarians when I saw the post. Check out my pics at the TDFG Yahoo! Group site. link |
Jeremy Sutcliffe | 28 Feb 2011 4:26 a.m. PST |
The Wyre Forest set (link above is, I suspect the same as the one in the Age of eagles site and is called Fire and Furia Francese – an F&F derivative. |
John Leahy | 28 Feb 2011 10:21 p.m. PST |
I have long believed that some Wars are more suited for particular level of combat. I think that the FPW does not lend itself well to lower level combat. Not that it can't be done OR that it may not be fun. However, the advantages that the Prussians had and which allowed them to win the war are really only present when fighting larger scale actions. Say a Corps or more. The lower level you have some decent French infantry available, gatlings and decent defensive ground in many cases. All that Corps level artillery for the Prussians isn't likely to all be present. Plus you won't have all those Prussian Divisions marching to the sound of the guns in a regimental game. YMMV. Thanks, John |
Pedrobear | 28 Feb 2011 11:22 p.m. PST |
I agree with John – with Division or below it's like Napoleonics on steroids; you miss out on the operational level. The good thing is you probably already have all the figures you need, so you can get a few sets of rules and pick and choose at your leisure. I personally own 1870, TTLGB, and TDFG. |
Mollinary | 01 Mar 2011 7:18 a.m. PST |
As with John and Pedrobear, it is great to game the larger scale operations, such as Gravelotte-St.Privat. For this scale of games, corps level and above, I am an ardent supported of TTLGB, which is simple enough to play with large numbers of units and players, but also has a great feel of both period and operational level. 1870 is good too! Mollinary |
Ben Waterhouse | 02 Mar 2011 8:42 a.m. PST |
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Old Contemptibles | 06 Mar 2011 5:05 p.m. PST |
All that Corps level artillery for the Prussians isn't likely to all be present. Plus you won't have all those Prussian Divisions marching to the sound of the guns in a regimental game. Corps artillery is represented in TDFG and we have divisions marching to the sound of the guns all the time. There is nothing better than to see Corps size battles made up of battalions. I'm not sure I would try it with 25mm because the table needed gets too large, but with 15mm figures, no porblem. The only disadvantage is the larger number of figures you need but once you have them, it is totally worth it. |
Weasel | 10 Mar 2011 10:03 a.m. PST |
I used to own Chassepot&Needlegun. It looked fine and decent, but it does require quite a bit mini's to get started on. |
John Leahy | 10 Mar 2011 2:41 p.m. PST |
Really? I own TDFG and thought the rules were solid. However, it looked to me and from what I have read online that a Division per side was where the rules were fitted to play. Certainly not a corps or more per side. How long do those large games last? Four hours or less or much longer? Thanks, John |
Old Contemptibles | 10 Mar 2011 6:15 p.m. PST |
From 6 to 8 hours. Usually only a corps per side. Some of those scenarios are quite large. I suspect most people use the optional rule that allows using fewer figures. |
Roger56 | 19 Mar 2013 7:54 p.m. PST |
Here's a comment. Died for Glory was written for someone with a gigantic table and endless funds. Polemos is there to sell Baccus figures. 1870 is for someone who has again a very big table and the funds and time to build massive terrain. They are only good for the comentary and the information on the battles of the Third Republic All rules with simultaneous movement are unplayable. Most wargamers are too bent on victory not to try to gimick them. Gentlemen wargames don't exist! The average dining room table, unless you are rich and had one custom built in your mansion, is 40inches by 58 imches with all the leaves in. How do I know? For the one million time, I went to every furniture store in this burg and measured them! You need to use some homegrown version of Fire and Fury that uses a large enough figure to stand scale so that only brigades appear on the table with tiny cavalry Regiments that are brigaded together, at Corps level. The ranges open up agreat deal so this is possible. Brigade Jaegers and Chasseurs a Pied in small brigades. The guns in 1870 are so numerous you will simply go broke buying them. You have to turn them into large scale corps assets with fewer figures. Remember the Empire were the idiots who gave their guns just two ranges for fusing their shell. The Republic fixed that and their gunners were more likely to press their guns forward. You can forget Mitrailleuses. They are not Machine guns but Volley guns less effective then 4# canister or grape. Ignoring historical organization is necessary to fight Historical Battles. You will never be able to do all historical battles even when doing that. 10s and down are fiddly or impossible to paint, and as expensive as 15s because you need more. H&R are only good for the Napoleonic war, if you can still paint them after age 35. Their FPW are cast front to back so they can't be painted as a strip. Baccus are cast to fit no rules but their own. Despite the wesite hype they are first class pain to paint. The only 10s you can get in the USA are Perrins. They and Pendrakens are far too busy and thus fiddly to paint. OG 12s only come in strips for some lines, not FPW. 25s cannot be had only 28, 30s and the like on up. Old Glory 25s are close to affordable with the 40% discount, and then only for the the English Civil War and the War of the Roses. They have no FPW. All 15mm infantry require 1/2 X 1/2 inches for one figure to sit on a stand That's it. Not anything a rule set says can change that. That's 13mmX13mm. Start looking for long period rules (19th Century) that are simple and easy to modify. Don't pay for a sales pitch. The pretty 28s shown in the pictures are advertizing. You are paying for advertizing. Advertizing should make the Price of rules go down not up to $50. USD The last figures you will want to consider are Minifigs. Their FPW are embarassing. It takes enormous nerve to charge 2.90GBP for a pack of those. Only available in England. They claim GFI went out of business because they did not charge enough. Despites protests to the contrary they went bankrupt because their front man was a blowhard crook. Outpost 15/18s are not available in the USA. The first you want to consider are Essex. They have the right surface detail and no stupid packs, canvas rolls, tent stakes, etc. to slow down painting. You can't get them in the USA (for which you can thank the last owner of Wargame-- don't tell me about his problems), and they are too pricy, new, 3.00GBP per pack (you simply double all these prices in the USA because of shipping) The people listed on the Essex site as stocklist have stock for FOG. They do not make investments like Wargames did, because they do not know the market. They all want $5.00 USD unless they are dumping what isn't selling fast enough for them. They will "special order." OG15s have very busy surfaces. They are a misery to paint, too much time per figure. Rank and File are no better. You either want to play wargames or pretend you're an artist? |