| ochoin deach | 07 Oct 2010 11:02 p.m. PST |
Religious nutter with a death wish or visionary before his time? Having just finished a book on the Sudan Wars, I've started another on Gordon himself. He certainly seemed to provoke a range of emotions and still does so. When you move the Victorian hagiography aside he seems a man of exceptional qualities but some outstanding flaws.
WWhat's your view of the man rather than the legend?
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| Mapleleaf | 07 Oct 2010 11:26 p.m. PST |
A proud and fanatical genius who thought that he knew more than others. |
| Cpt Arexu | 07 Oct 2010 11:56 p.m. PST |
Nutter with a deathwish, like Duggout Doug after him… stop me if you've heard this – a field grade officer with a 'nuanced' background is sent to a foreign country to evaluate the situation and disentangle his nations citizens and the foreign folk who are on his nation's side from looming troubles… |
| Sane Max | 08 Oct 2010 2:08 a.m. PST |
The only advantage he had over Doug is that when the  hit the fan, rather than Boarding a steamer and promising the terrified Citizens and Soldiery 'I will Return' he stayed put. Victorian Nutter of the Worst Stripe. by all accounts a remarkably good leader on the ground – his redeeming feature. Pat |
| David Gray | 08 Oct 2010 2:28 a.m. PST |
Very small men have difficulty recognizing the virtues of large men. |
| Sane Max | 08 Oct 2010 3:05 a.m. PST |
But I am over 11 feet tall, and in perfect proportion. Pat |
| Prince Alberts Revenge | 08 Oct 2010 5:11 a.m. PST |
I think Gordon approached situations with some naivete and lack of comprehension for nuanced situations (which was also could be attributed for society/culture of the time). There were a lot of questionable moves that he made during the whole Khartoum fiasco. Gordon thought he had a handle on the situation, but he didn't. When he realized what he was up against, it was too late. I will say that Gordon was a principled man, energetic commander that seemed to rise to the occasion when his back was up against the wall. If I had a situation that was a near lost-cause, you could throw him in there knowing he would tackle it with determination (and in the face of death). I don't think I'd want him as my commander or subordinate though. |
| MajorB | 08 Oct 2010 5:54 a.m. PST |
He was quite successful in China where he was promoted to the rank of titu ("Chief commander of one province's military"), one of the highest grades in the Chinese army. The British Army promoted Gordon to Lieutenant-Colonel and he was made a Companion of the Bath. That's where he got his nickname "Chinese Gordon". |
aecurtis  | 08 Oct 2010 8:04 a.m. PST |
His actions in China don't do much to argue against "Religious nutter with a death wish". For a look into the minds of two not dissimilar characters, review the correspondence between Gordon and Richard Burton (and Isabel Burton): link Allen |
| Sane Max | 08 Oct 2010 8:39 a.m. PST |
ah now Richard Burton – he was a Man's Man ;.) Pat |
| MajorB | 08 Oct 2010 8:52 a.m. PST |
His actions in China don't do much to argue against "Religious nutter with a death wish". I didn't say they did. |
| aecurtis | 08 Oct 2010 9:26 a.m. PST |
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| ochoin deach | 08 Oct 2010 12:40 p.m. PST |
"ah now Richard Burton – he was a Man's Man ;.)" Yes, indeed. Marrying lizabeth Taylor, twice, took real guts. |
| Cpt Arexu | 08 Oct 2010 9:49 p.m. PST |
Gordon and Doug both had orders, and neither could be arsed to follow them. Props to Gordon for his victories in China, but lurking around Khartoum until it was too late was flaming stupid on his part. Larger than life certainly, but he drank his own koolaid. Likewise props to Macarthur for his post-war occupation decisions, but he decided to write his own orders in the PI, and made a variety of other ill-thought decisions before, during, and after the war. A large man, perhaps, but a great man, no. HE never married Elizabeth Taylor even ONCE! |
