"EMPIRE and Stars*n*Bars available once again!" Topic

what's more funny about this is that over on this other site they will tell each other it was all our fault…

I have never played Stars and Bars ACW and don't know anyone who has, BUT it contained a very large and very useful appendix that was worth the price of the booklet by itself. If that is still included, then, it is certainly worth a look, especially to some relative beginners who may not have a lot of research material handy!!

I played a lot of Stars n Bars in the 80's and found it to be an enjoyable set of rules and as mentioned, the OOB's and research in the back are pretty darned good. My one issue with Stars n'Bars now is that Fire & Fury and Johnny Reb III so dominate ACW gaming from a market share point of view, I'm unsure if there is a body of players available for opponents.

link

I'm so sorry that

So, he posted his own little flame on his own little forum, and then locked the thread to prevent comment! If it wasn't so pitiful it would be hilarious!

To quote him, in words that he should consider apply to himself!

"It never ceases to amaze me how some web site forums allow their members to act. Some people seem to think that because this is the internet, they can do or say what they wish with complete impunity."

Now, Mr. Pitts doesn't appear to be , so I'll try to be clear, just because , and I'm appalled that this person somehow represents my hobby.

Mr. Pitts, you are .

I think that about covers it. What do you think, did I miss anything?

Cheers,

Christopher
(or maybe I should call myself "The Christopher Event"?)

TMP is the pleasentest forum I know regardless of genre, and I've been online since 1980.

BTW the old trope of people not using their own names was old back in 1980 and remains old today. Besides, who is to stop us from making up a 'real' name? What can people do? Have us submit our IRS income tax returns as proof? Time to get over it.

Don't need this guy's attitude…pass.

The funny thing is that the one who is ing everyone off will welcome that. You are obviously not worthy of buying his product. Move on, you contemptible sniveling toad.

MY real name, by the way, is Norman St.John Polevaulter.

MY real name, by the way, is Norman St.John Polevaulter.

How is that pronounced?

Yrs

Hippolyte Featherstonhough-Crichton

Personally, I think this thread should be locked and let folks sell their product un-molested. Vote with your wallet not your mouth!

To some of you, I want to extend my deepest apologies for offending you. No doubt that at times I have all the tact of a ball pin hammer. :-)

Rich Bliss – If you are interested in Casus Belli, join The War Event as a free registered member, send me a PM with your mailing address, and I will send you a complimentary copy of the rules and you can judge for yourself.

To Mr. Caras – I may have misjudged your intent here and if so, I extend my deepest and most sincere apologies to you. If you still are interested in the product you inquired about, I will make you the same offer as above to Mr. Bliss.

If you have any questions regarding the site or how to navigate it, please email me directly and I will be glad to assist you.

- Greg Pitts

Ok, move along. Nothing more to see here.

"BTW the old trope of people not using their own names was old back in 1980 and remains old today. Besides, who is to stop us from making up a 'real' name? What can people do? Have us submit our IRS income tax returns as proof? Time to get over it."

"MY real name, by the way, is Norman St.John Polevaulter."

I think that all of us, and especially Mr. Pitts, could use some advice like that proffered by the gentleman on this YouTube link: YouTube link

I offer this only for the entertainment value…yes it is relevant.

TMP link

and

link

…

Mr. Smith,

You continue your libel after having been shown to be in the wrong to begin with (with regards to Skirmish), and even after you have been warned both by me and your internet provider service to stop.

Why not instead spend your time telling us all why

I cannot tell you the number of people that have come to me since the incident with you and your associates at the event you call "Skirmish", who have told me quite simply, "Greg, you were in the right". Little wonder, IMHO, why your "con" continues to have smaller and smaller attendance each year.

So go ahead Mr. Smith and continue your rants, so that all may know what you are.

When I make a mistake, and I make my fair share, I am man enough to own up to it and apologize. If you do not accept the apology then at that point the problem is not with me, but with you.

Let it go!

To some of you, I want to extend my deepest apologies for offending you. No doubt that at times I have all the tact of a ball pin hammer. :-)

I fear your issues may extend some distance beyond a self-confessed lack of tact.

…

What is confusing me is…
The War Event has a bit of a shot at someone here, early in this thread, because they are using a Nic not their real name. But he posted this as "The War Event". There doesn't seem to have been any acknowledgement of hypocrisy.
Or if innocent then that it might appear so.
Or was there and I missed it?
Max!

I really want it published. Please do. That way I can find out what the hell you are talking about!

…

"What is confusing me is…
The War Event has a bit of a shot at someone here, early in this thread, because they are using a Nic not their real name. But he posted this as "The War Event". There doesn't seem to have been any acknowledgement of hypocrisy.
Or if innocent then that it might appear so.
Or was there and I missed it?
Max"!

PM'd you on this – You missed it.

- Greg

Mr. Smith,

You know very well what I am talking about.

Come on Mr. Smith; we want to hear this in YOUR words, not mine.

We are all ears!

Okay, you got me.

One day while I was singing in the bathroom a horny sheep fell through the roof. It immediately jumped on the chair and knocked over the mouse. Then it ran out the door into the attic and laid a finger off the stool. It then knocked a glass of phlegm off the coffee table. After fourteen minutes of chasing the sheep through the house I finally caught it and put it outside. It quickly climbed the nearest apple.

Create your own story here link

Greg,

I hate to say this but you have not just shot yourself in the foot, you have literally blown it off…

…but what is more scary is that you are now aiming at the other.

Have it your way.

The general attitude of so many empire fanatics seems to have much in common with this guy, Pitts. We played empire for years and years. After it got complicated in the later editions I don't think we ever really finishing a game, primarily out of sheer exhaustion or disgust over the arguments.

Very few of my gaming mates play it any more so I doubt having the rules available is going to make any difference to them at all. Sad, it really was fun early on when it was fairly simple and pretty easy to learn. But as layers of complication were added and no real "leap" in playability was gained it became almost a chore to play, …not a joy.

That's when we began to play other games and other periods. There are still a few fanatics who play in many gaming communities I visit but most of the gamers I know who do play empire have gone back to the beginning when it was still simple and a fun game to play, …and not a "simulation".

Will

Will,

You kind of say it all. If you want to play checkers, do so. If you want a game that offers the true feel of Napoleonic warfare then play EMPIRE.

The choice is up to each person, and that's all this thread was about before it was allowed to go off track.

Empire and Stars*n*Bars are once again available.

- Greg

Strange that. Horse for courses I guess Fuzzy as every Empire player I know here in Brisbane (and that's nearly 20 at the moment!) play Empire V without a problem. In fact, the campaign I am currently involved with have "finished" a dozen less than that many months at an average of 2 hours a week. Must be something in the water. In fact 1 of the group I play with have ADDED a few more things in! I find Empire quite easy to play and easy to teach to others whereas I am really frustrated with rules such as Napoleons Battles. Other people find Nap Battles the bees knees and can't get their head around Empire. Each to his own.

As I suggested, horses for courses as over time, needs from a game and/or a set of rules change as does the community one plays in. And Empire is certainly not the only set of rules to satisfy a group of players need for more realistic experience of napoleonic warfare. There are many fine sets out there these days. Different people look for and find different things in rules.

David
wardepot.blogspot.com
6to20painting.blogspot.com

Greg, Some time ago I converted my thousands of 15mm Napoleonic figures to play our version of "Volley and Bayonet". We can play a corps per player game with four to eight players in four or five hours to a conclusion. The best part is there are no arguments over the rules.

When I want to play tactical I play a version of CLS. Our "group" link has been playing Napoleonics since the late 1960's. I didn't become involved until the mid 70's and have only been able to play occasionally because of my job though much more in the past few years.

Empire isn't fun for me anymore and it hasn't been fun for decades, but that's just my opinion.

Good luck with your revival. My only suggestion would be to figure out a way to get more people interested, …not drive them away.

respectfully, Will

This is like watching a religious fanatic pretend he is tolerant.

"If you want a game that offers the true feel of Napoleonic warfare then play EMPIRE".
You should add, "IMHO".
I could argue Lasalle, LFS, HAZZAH or any other of the many good / great rule systems available today does the exact same thing,…
Rules really are a "personal choice" kinda thing; IMHO.
Cheers
Scott Driscoll

"This is like watching a religious fanatic pretend he is tolerant."

Perhaps to add a bit of fair play – this is like watching any fanatic (whehter Atheist, Muslim, Communist, Christian, Green, Nazi, Gender or Sexuality, Hindu, Animist, Budhist, Taoist, did I leave any out) Lol! pretend he is tolerant.

Yep! John the OFM, who needs TV when you've got TMP. LOL

Still enough said this is getting embarrassing to read and reminds me more of dealing with my 4 year nephew then mature well read adults…. Lets move on. As WarDepot Dave said, Horses for Courses. I prefer this and some prefer that. Let it go everyone.

As for War Event you almost had me change my mind when you apologized – the right thing to do – but then you went right back and launched at everyone. Mate its about 3 things customer service, customer choice and being thick skinned to those that do not like your product. Do not look at it personally, just Horses for Courses mate. Take it from someone in the Hobby and in the Hobby Business. Leave emotion out and all will be well.

So anyway lets move on, surely there is more important things to discuss :)

Greg, you really should try and relax. Maybe you should find a hobby! I hear that wargaming can be very relaxing!!

Seriously though. We all have stress in our lives, but the idea is to reach retirement without having a heart attack. A nice glass of single malt and several hours of painting should help clear the air. SO EVERYONE GET BACK TO PAINTING RIGHT NOW!!! Joe

Dawghouse filling up!!

"SO EVERYONE GET BACK TO PAINTING RIGHT NOW!!! Joe"

Can we cheat and use Army Painter, it takes all the effort out of painting. LOL!

This thread really deserves a standing ovation. Such drama. Dang it, I've misplaced my opera glasses!

Hey bavoisSYW! Just drink more scotch and absolutely no effort is required. Joe

Hey bavoisSYW! Just drink more scotch and absolutely no effort is required. Joe

LOL! :)

I have never played Stars and Bars ACW and don't know anyone who has, BUT it contained a very large and very useful appendix that was worth the price of the booklet by itself. If that is still included, then, it is certainly worth a look, especially to some relative beginners who may not have a lot of research material handy!!

Your thinking of 2nd edition (blue cover if I recall correctly). This is 3rd edition and doesn't contain the info you remember. 3rd Edition is much like Empire 3rd Edition in mechanics

You kind of say it all. If you want to play checkers, do so. If you want a game that offers the true feel of Napoleonic warfare then play EMPIRE.

Adding arrogance to the mix now huh? Have you ever stopped to consider two things: one, you may be wrong and it's just your opinion; and two, there are a lot of other high quality rules sets on the market, several recent ones coming to mind, whose authors you are rubbing up the wrong way.

And yes, I've played Empire a lot, but it still ended up on Ebay a couple of years ago and didn't sell for that much…

*sigh* that turned out well didn't it?

Oh well, two more rulesets that wont be taking up room on the shelf…..

Stars and Bars without the great appendixes is not something I could reccomend ( so what, who am I anyway) since I don't play the game and never have. I am glad that you (Berlichtingen) informed me and others that it is a different content from what I purchased from MR. Bowden ages ago! Thank you sir!

And just to clear up the name thing , you can call me Ray or you can call me Dave, or you can…..

Wow, this thread went off the rails almost right away. Looks like Bill will have to build a new annex to the Dawghaus just for this thread: "The Memorial War Event Annex. Please use your real name and check all guns at the front desk. Enjoy your stay." Reminds me of the old newsgroup days.

A good lesson in customer service.

I'm changing my name to The Pilum Event and all TMPers should change their names too.

WOW. This thread really esculated eh!

Not so bad really. I've played in actual EMPIRE games which generated more drama, but then again that's why we no longer play those rules.

This thread is a shinning example of what is best about our hobby…good grief…

I too played Empire II & III in the 80's….we enjoyed the system for a season and it was my first introduction into Historical Miniatures gaming…many fond memories…a few not so fond, when playing the system…we switched to Napoleon's Battles after a couple of big arguments…more to do with personalities than the rules…I remember being accused of playing "checkers" when we made the switch to NB…pretty funny….

How do I get these rules? I have followed the link and I can't really see what to do. Also can you tell me what I get for the price. The money quoted seems very high for a pdf product.

Got my copy last week. Basically went to site, joined as premium member, then ordered the rules. Prett easy.