John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 5:37 p.m. PST |
In honor of Mal's soon to be published masterpiece, I ask the question. What is your favorite WW2 naval novel? Coincidentally (or not), both of these are based on convoy action. When I was a child, I liked childish things
I was a huge fan of Alastair MacClean's "HMS Ulysses". It is now hard to read without breaking out laughing at its poor writing and cliches. It borders on the surreal reading how much MacClean can throw at that poor ship. No asteroids, at least. The REAL THING is Nicholas Monsarrat's "The Cruel Sea". It was made into a splendid movie too, with Jack Hawkins at his finest. No one can say "What is it, Number One?" quite like Mister Hawkins. The book is so good, it is Literature. I will frankly admit it. This is a plea for new reading material. I need a break from Elmore Leonard, as good as he is. My only needs are action, good writing and good characters. I am easy. |
Major General Stanley | 31 Oct 2009 5:43 p.m. PST |
"Snorkers, Good oh", another vote for the cruel sea |
wrgmr1 | 31 Oct 2009 5:48 p.m. PST |
Second vote for "The Cruel Sea", really it is an excellent read! |
mweaver | 31 Oct 2009 5:58 p.m. PST |
I too loved MacClean's "HMS Ulysses" when I first read it. Years later, rereading it, some of the warts were more obvious. Mind you, those Murmansk convoys were subjected to just about everything except asteroids. In fairness to MacLean, it was his first novel. He became a better writer later in his career. He is the first writer I ever came across who became so successful that he discovered he could bang off a really crappy novel and it would still sell well. His later books were dreadful. Sadly, he is not the last writer to go this route. |
Major Mike | 31 Oct 2009 6:01 p.m. PST |
The Caine Mutiny by Herman Wouk. Well written to be able to see the main event thru the eyes of the participants, being there, and in the court room. |
Mathion | 31 Oct 2009 6:09 p.m. PST |
A second vote for the Caine Mutiny. Fantastic book turned into a great movie. |
Some other name | 31 Oct 2009 6:11 p.m. PST |
Das Boot and The Cruel Sea both rank toward the top for me. |
Editor in Chief Bill | 31 Oct 2009 6:16 p.m. PST |
I also liked South by Java Head by Alistair MacLean – some Pacific naval action. Perhaps I should give Monsarrat a second chance. I read his Kappillan of Malta as a teenager, and didn't care much for it. (Perhaps I was too young for it then
) |
John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 7:14 p.m. PST |
Too bad I can't cross-post this to TMP Polls Suggestions. Or, can I??? |
15th Hussar | 31 Oct 2009 7:14 p.m. PST |
HMS Ulysses, but Douglas Reeman has written several great books on the period too! |
Shagnasty | 31 Oct 2009 7:44 p.m. PST |
Loved "Ulysses" but haven't read it recently. "The Cruel Sea" is a great book and movie. Just recently reread it. Reeman is very formulaic but has written about all kinds of sea warfare. He is particularly good at the Narrow Seas stuff as he served in MTBs. For history, you might try Atkins' trilogy on the US army in WW II. I'm not a great student of that war but his stuff is very good. |
Editor in Chief Bill | 31 Oct 2009 7:50 p.m. PST |
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John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 7:53 p.m. PST |
Yeah, that's the easiest way
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John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 7:59 p.m. PST |
Edward L Beach's "Run Silent Run Deep" is pretty good, too. Great action, along with some maddening duels with bureaucrats, trying to fix the defective torpedo problem. |
coopman | 31 Oct 2009 8:11 p.m. PST |
"The Battle of the Narrow Seas" is my favorite. |
thosmoss | 31 Oct 2009 8:37 p.m. PST |
recently read an exerpt of "Sink the Bismarck" by Forester, and found it remarkably compelling. Keep meaning to find the entire book. |
John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 8:39 p.m. PST |
For history, you might try Atkins' trilogy on the US army in WW II. I'm not a great student of that war but his stuff is very good. Doesn't sound very naval
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John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 8:41 p.m. PST |
"The Battle of the Narrow Seas" is my favorite.
recently read an exerpt of "Sink the Bismarck" by Forester, Are they novels? |
Tom Bryant | 31 Oct 2009 8:48 p.m. PST |
My favorite is James Bassett's "Harms Way" Made into a great movie and a well done tale of the Pacific war. |
T Callahan | 31 Oct 2009 9:41 p.m. PST |
"First Team" by John Lundstrom Pub: Naval Institute Press, MD excellent book on US Naval Air Operations from Pearl Harbor to Midway. I think it is the definitive book on USN air operations for WWII. I couldn't put it down. Escort Commander original publish as "Walker, R.N.". Bio on Capt. John Walker RN and his influence on the development of ASW warfare during WWII. Finally the "Cruel Sea" book and movie. Terry |
15th Hussar | 31 Oct 2009 9:42 p.m. PST |
Reeman/Kent IS formulaic, but he does come up w/some good ones
matter of fact, his "just-Post WW2" book
The White Guns
is one of my faves of all time. Besides his Med and MTB books, he did good work on the Singapore novel and the "faux" Battle of the River Plate book
he can hit them out of the park when he wants. |
John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 9:56 p.m. PST |
DOES ANYONE READ TITLES ANYMORE???? NOVELS!!!!! FICTION!!!!!! |
John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 10:24 p.m. PST |
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John the OFM | 31 Oct 2009 10:28 p.m. PST |
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rmaker | 31 Oct 2009 11:29 p.m. PST |
"The Cruel Sea", "The Caine Mutiny", and "Run Silent, Run Deep" are all good. Others deserving mention here are "The Enemy Below", "Sharks and Little Fishes", and "Away All Boats". If you're in a C. S. Forester mood, I'd say "The Ship" and "The Good Shepherd" ought to go on your list along with, if you like short story collections, "Gold from Crete" and "The Man in the Yellow Raft". If you liked "Harm's Way", try Bassett's other book, "Cmdr. Prince, USN". |
TheDreadnought | 31 Oct 2009 11:36 p.m. PST |
I was unimpressed by Reeman. Admittedly, I've only read 'Battlecruiser'. . . but the book was long on angst and romance and short on naval action. Probably 75% of the novel took place on land. I found it very disappointing. Lately I've been getting my fix reading well-written non-fiction. But as far as pure fiction goes, I enjoyed Days of Infamy (although I heard the first one wasn't very good and thus didn't read it) and The Destroyermen series is very entertaining. . . although that's really into the sci-fi category. The Weapons of Choice novels started out with a fantastic premise – but I don't feel they ever really delivered. . . but again. . . sci-fi. HMS Ulysses I found extremely depressing. The Cruiser I got part way into then got distracted by something else. Have to go back and give that one another try. Rising Sun Victorious had some good pieces in it. Its WWI, but Alexander Fullerton's 'Blooding of the Guns' was excellent. Although I found 'Jutland 1916 – Death in the Grey Wastes' just as gripping and it was non-fiction. I'll have to lay hands on some of these classics that were made into movies. I enjoyed the movies, I am sure I would like the books even more. |
Martin Rapier | 01 Nov 2009 2:34 a.m. PST |
For me it is a tie between The Cruel Sea and HMS Ulysses. HMS Ulysses is to my mind Alistair MacLeans best book as it is somewhat auto-biographical so very heartfelt and personal. The Murmansk convoys was what he did in the navy (he served on HMS Royalist, a Dido class cruiser). |
Connard Sage | 01 Nov 2009 2:36 a.m. PST |
'RAF: An Illustrated History from 1918' is an excellent read. Recommended |
Bangorstu | 01 Nov 2009 5:22 a.m. PST |
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basileus66 | 01 Nov 2009 7:22 a.m. PST |
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troopwo | 01 Nov 2009 7:32 a.m. PST |
Another vote for Montserrat, "snorkers, good oh". "I say, maybe number one has a bun in the oven?" |
rddfxx | 01 Nov 2009 9:57 a.m. PST |
The Cruel Sea by far, with The Enemy Below running a distant second I also recommend Jan De Hartog's "The Captain" |
John the OFM | 01 Nov 2009 10:59 a.m. PST |
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Crow Bait | 01 Nov 2009 11:41 a.m. PST |
"Up Periscope" by Robb White. It was a good movie also. |
Neotacha | 01 Nov 2009 2:02 p.m. PST |
So is this the thread where I say my favorite novel is Thorne Smith's Did She Fall? ;) |
John the OFM | 01 Nov 2009 2:18 p.m. PST |
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dasfrpsl | 01 Nov 2009 2:26 p.m. PST |
"The Ship" by C.S. Forester. Written during the war, it's a story set in a light cruiser in action in the Med. One of my absolute favourites. |
Mainly28s | 01 Nov 2009 2:36 p.m. PST |
Geoffrey Jenkins did a few good ones. A Twist of Sand and A Grue of Ice are probably my two favourites. |
Bellbottom | 01 Nov 2009 2:45 p.m. PST |
The Sea Shall Not Have Them by John Harris (about air sea rescue in the channel), who has written a long series of excellent Military books. I believe he also writes as Max Hennesy (or was that Elliston Trevor?) and did three trilogies, one naval, one military and one air. |
Captain Apathy | 01 Nov 2009 2:47 p.m. PST |
Ok, how about this one? Its fiction and navel, but not WWII
The Ruby in Her Navel: A Novel by Barry Unsworth link |
John D Salt | 01 Nov 2009 2:50 p.m. PST |
"Very Ordinary Seaman", by J P W Mallalieu. All the best, John. |
StarfuryXL5 | 01 Nov 2009 3:50 p.m. PST |
Not a popular title at the genetics bank. |
15th Hussar | 01 Nov 2009 5:26 p.m. PST |
was unimpressed by Reeman. Admittedly, I've only read 'Battlecruiser'. . . but the book was long on angst and romance and short on naval action. Probably 75% of the novel took place on land. I found it very disappointing. I could write a doctoral thesis on this
true
fact and it LITERALLY starts around
1980'ish (for Kent, that would be "The Inshore Squadron"). Before 1980
his books were excellent
but then he divorced and his book dedications changed from (or to) "KIM" as opposed to Winifred (books not in front of me, so please excuse any errors). From that date forward, no matter what he claims, his new "LOVE" became a co-writer and his Bolitho books started becoming Heavy Regency Romances. He still hit the odd "ball out of the park", like "The Darkening Sea", but there is a definite difference
pick up one of his pre-1980 books and you'll be suitably impressed! |
Ed Mohrmann | 01 Nov 2009 6:20 p.m. PST |
_The Cruel Sea_ _The Ship_ _The Good Shepherd_ _HMS Ulysses_ _The Cruiser_ All good reads
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Fatman | 01 Nov 2009 6:38 p.m. PST |
I would reccomend the Max Hennessy, as stated above John Harriss under a penname, Lion At Sea trilogy. OK only the third is World War 2 but all three are cracking reads and yo need to read the first two to understand the back story. I would also suggest Alexander Fullertons Nicholas Everard series. With these you can ignore the first threee WW II books, although they are also good reads, and start at book four "Storm Force From Narvick" Fatman |
Major Mike | 01 Nov 2009 7:26 p.m. PST |
Set in the Coral Sea, there is Martin Caidens book, "Whip" and there is also another book by him set in the back waters of the Pacific centered around a bypassed Japanese island titled, "The Last Dogfight". Both books are more aviation than naval, but there is air/naval action in "Whip". |
The G Dog | 01 Nov 2009 9:54 p.m. PST |
Another vote for "The Cruel Sea". I'll nominate "Mister Roberts" and "The Ninety and Nine" for good measure. |
nsolomon99 | 02 Nov 2009 3:57 a.m. PST |
Add my vote for "The Cruel Sea". With the OFM's indulgence on HIS thread can I also add, as an Australian, that I've never heard or read of the expression "snorkers" for sausages. My late father was was of WWII vintage and fought with the 2nd AIF in the Middle East and SW Pacific Theatres and never used the expression either FWIW. |
Connard Sage | 02 Nov 2009 11:14 a.m. PST |
'Snorkers' is Brit slang for sausages, but I've never heard it used widely. Apart from on Saint Wogan of Surrey's radio show. |
spacehulker | 02 Nov 2009 1:19 p.m. PST |
Very Ordinary Seaman by J P W Mallalieu. A classic, rates up there with the Cruel Sea. |