Help support TMP


"Information on uniforms 1650-1660" Topic


5 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the Renaissance Discussion Message Board


Areas of Interest

Renaissance

Featured Hobby News Article


Featured Link


Featured Showcase Article

28mm Acolyte Vampires - Based

The Acolyte Vampires return - based, now, and ready for the game table.


Featured Workbench Article

Painting a 15mm Tibetan DBA Army: The Cavalry

Don't let the horses daunt you!


Featured Profile Article

Editor Julia's 2015 Christmas Project

Personal logo Editor Julia Supporting Member of TMP would like your support for a special project.


1,086 hits since 28 Sep 2009
©1994-2026 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?


TMP logo

Membership

Please sign in to your membership account, or, if you are not yet a member, please sign up for your free membership account.
Charles BTB28 Sep 2009 7:14 a.m. PST

Hi I'm looking for information about uniforms for troops from the Franco-Spanish War and Anglo-Spanish war. I have some information for the English but for the French and Spanish I'm not coming up with much.

Thanks
Rich.

The Jim Jones Cocktail Hour28 Sep 2009 12:04 p.m. PST

Mostly still in the garb of the ECW. The long hemmed coat didn't come in until after 1660. The best site for the Spanish is:

link

Major William Martin RM30 Sep 2009 10:05 a.m. PST

Rich,

I'll second the recommendation for Dr. Pierre Picouet's "Tercio" site, it is one of my most frequently referenced sites. And it does include some information on the French, Dutch and English as well as the Spanish. There is a new link for it though, as he has had difficulty with the Geocities site hosting and has changed provider's. The new link is:

link

For the French, I would recommend two articles by Curt Johnson on the Xenophon Group's site (the Early Modern Warfare Society, former publisher's of "Gorget & Sash" magazine). They can be found here by scrolling to the bottom of the page for the two articles by Curt:

xenophongroup.com/EMW/EMW.htm

I would also recommend an excellent article that Bill Boyle did that is available for download on the Vexillia web site. Go to the link below and then click on the link on the left for "TYW Uniform Guide".

vexillia.ltd.uk/news.html

Next, I would highly recommend Stephané Thion's excellent book "French Armies of the Thirty Year's War" which is available through either On Military Matters or from Caliver in the UK. It contains a fantastic collection of period artwork depicting French troops into the 1650's.

As has already been stated though, "uniforms" as we think of them did not become standard until after the dates you specify. In the case of the French, 1668 is given as the official date for foreign regiments and 1670 for "native" French regiments, although individual colonel's would have uniformed their units to some degree if they chose to. There is a very prominent painting in Stephané's book of the French at Rocroi in 1643 in which one battalion of the Gardes Francaises are shown in all dark blue uniforms, although these were officially changed to gray in 1661. In Curt's article on the French line infantry, he indicates that there was one German regiment in French service, Clérac, that was uniformed in gray coats with reversed lining/facings as early as 1659 in imitation of the English troops that were fighting for Schomburg in Portugal. As to the Spanish, they were similar to the French in that the first official uniforms are not recorded until after 1660, and then only to the five senior, or "viejos" Tercio's, although there were some specific units uniformed by their colonel's as an individual matter.

Prior to the official uniforming of troops, the most common element on the Continent was the "field sign" agreed upon by the various powers. For the French this was a white sash worn by all troops, but in various and different ways (over either shoulder, around the waist, etc.). For the Dutch it was orange, and for the Spanish it was red. It was also not unknown for Spanish troops to be issued cassocks or cloaks with a red Cross of Burgundy and to wear red plumes.

One other prominent exception to the above that I am aware of, besides the English under Schomburg, is the English New Model contingent that fought under the French (Turenne) at the 2nd Battle of the Dunes (Dunkirk) in 1658, which were uniformed in red coats. However, there were also English Royalists fighting in the Spanish army at that battle that were not recorded as uniformed.

Bill
Sir William the Aged
warsoflouisxiv.blogspot.com

Rich Knapton01 Oct 2009 11:32 a.m. PST

Bill, with regards to foreign battalions serving in the Dutch army, would they also wear the orange of the Dutch?

Rich

Major William Martin RM01 Oct 2009 8:31 p.m. PST

I can't say conclusively Rich, but from evrything I've seen, even foreign regiments in a country's service would wear the accepted field sign. I do know that German and Swiss regiments in French service wore white sashes according to numerous sources, and even the "German" cuirassiers under Condé at Rocroi are supposed to have worn them.

Bill

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.