"1:2400 WW2 - Recommend me new rules please!" Topic

Hi Guys

Need some recommendations for new naval rules, please!

Currently we're using VaS which is nice and simple, but after a while this simplicity has actually made it a frustrating ruleset to use.

What we're beginning to be frustrated with is the lack of granularity with VaS – for example;

D6 mechanics are too simplistic to capture the nuances of naval combat, and ships are either immensely powerful or largely useless. The fact that an 18" shell has the same effect as a 6" shell is silly – yes, the 18" is three times more likely to achieve damage, but the damage is the same in that it's one point.

Damage Hit Points – again, a simplification, but last night (for example) HMS Revenge and Scharnhorst were knocking lumps out of each other in a convoy action. The Revenge had taken 4 (damaging) Torpedo hits, and around 75% damage topside, yet was still operating without any functionality problems as none of those hits had been critical.

Flooding – Revenge last night – four successful Torpedoes hit home, but no flooding, or incremental problems to account for the four gaping holes in it's Port side.

Subs – way too simplistic. Again, last night's convoy action saw three subs eliminated by Tribal class destroyers one turn after they'd revealed themselves. No method to run deep to escape detroyers or decrease chance of detection.

So whilst the simplicity is nice in VaS, especially to the casual player, to our mind it works against it if you play it regularly.

However, the caveat is that we don't want to swing to the polar opposite and end up with a simulation which requires an hour to resolve a broadside.

Any ideas please!

General Quarters III.

See them here:

link

GQ 3 is more accurate than VAS by far but still capable of handling 12-20 ships per side. For fewer ships and even more detail, I'd consider Seekreig V or Command at Sea.

I'll add my 2 cents for GQ 3 as well. More detailed than VaS, yet pretty easy to learn and it doesn't bog down.

Damage is incremental and begins to have an effect immediately – a ship taking 4 torpedoes would be in a world of hurt and definitely wouldn't be performing as if nothing had happened. Broadsides take about a minute (at most) to resolve.

Chieftan – You should DEFINITELY check out Naval Thunder: Battleship Row.

In fact, while researching people's likes/dislikes about naval wargaming during the writing process, "plays fast like VaS but with better granularity between ships" was one of the guiding principles.

Naval Thunder: Battleship Row features the kind of incremental damage you are looking for without slowing down the game. It also has a robust, completely modular, optional rule system so you can tailor it to exactly the level of detail you are interested in.

You can get it here, for $14.95 USD
link

Steel Dreadnought Games specializes in naval games and offers ongoing support for all its products. These are not "once and done" releases for us. The first expansion for Naval Thunder: Battleship Row will be out in the next month or so.

Looks interesting Harry, although I fancy you may be a little biased! :)

Any independent reviews, and does it come in hard-copy?

I'll have a shuftie at GQ III as well chaps… thanks!

Maybe just a little. . . ;)

. . . but as a former VaS player myself, I know exactly what you are talking about.

Here is an independent review of the WWI version of the rules (Naval Thunder: Clash of Dreadnoughts) by the guys at View from the Turret.

link

CoD and Battleship Row are very similar at a fundamental level, although obviously Battleship Row incorporates additional rules for things like aircraft, better subs, radar directed fire control, and so on. But the systems share a 95% commonality in their DNA so to speak.

Here are a few comments I have received in emails from customers (really!):

In a word: superb. I've never seen a better rules set for WW1. Can't wait for the update that provides the rest of the world's fleets. Just wanted to send my thanks for offering this great set of well thought out rules. This is honestly the set I've been looking for my entire life.
- L. Teiper

I recently picked up a copy of Clash of Dreadnoughts and Rise of the Battleship from wargamevault and I would like to compliment you on what a great job you have done. Your approach to naval combat addresses a lot of the concerns/problems I have had with previous rules
- P. West

Yesterday we played our first game using your rules. All I have to say, great game with GREAT rules.
- B. Breuer

I have recently bought Naval Thunder as a PDF via the Vault and first impressions are good – well done, Sir! Can't wait to get some miniatures onto the table top.
- A. Wilson

Here are some rule book overviews that may be helpful:

link

Mark "Extra Crispy" Severin
Owner, Scale Creep Miniatures
ScaleCreep.com
DeepFriedHappyMice.com

Another commendation for GQ 3.

Hmmm.

Well, it seems Harry's enthusiasm for his book may be well founded. I think we'll give it a go!

Besides, at £9, it would be rude not to.