"Valiant minis and compatable 1/72 kits" Topic

Howdy. I recently purchased "Rapid Fire" rules and am interested in getting some figs and vehicles to test out. I want to use the Valiant 1/72 hard pastic figs and would like some advice on vehicles. I used to have the old Airfix tank kits but they would be a bit small. Any advice on best/cheapest kits in that scale? I seem to remebre Matchbox were much bigger? Are the Dragon metalkits same scale?

cheers

We use Dragon and Forces of Valor pre-paints and they work for us. The plastic minis that come with the Forces tanks are almost as tall as the Valiant minis. So, they are true 1/72 scale.

Interestingly PSR reckons that the Valiant stuff is more 1/60 than 1/72

matchbox are 1/76. you'd need at last 1/72.

I find that my Valiants match closely with 1/60. Not exactly, but close enough. Much better than 1/72 models.

They're certainly VERY big compared to other "20mil" figures.

Thanks for the advice. I take it then that I'd need to look for 25mm vehicles, probably much more expensive?

cheers

Hi
Go with the "DRAGON", "Hobby Master" or "Forces Of Valour" pre painted Diecast tanks and AFVs. Great kits, the right size, and "ready to play" out of the box!

I've seen a lot of the Dragon stuff and it looks very nice. Do you think they would look too small with the Valiant figures?

Trailape- do you know who stocks Dragon and forces of Valor in Australia? cheers

I'm painting some caesar modern 1/72 at the moment.
On the side I have a sprue of Valiant US infantry I got free with a magazine.
Placing a caesar figure next to a valiant one…
The difference in scale is HUGE and very very obvious.
The Valiant figure is much wider and more than a head taller.
The garand rifle on the sprue (also) works out about a fifth over scale for 1/72.

Caesar, Dragon and forces of valor are 1/72.

I'd suggest the simplest approach is to go with figures and vehicles which really are 1/72 and forget Valiant.

I must disagree with my comrades re:Valiant and Dragon/Valor armor. IMO the bendy Airfix/Caesar style plastics look too small next to Valor and Dragon armor. I also have some Dixon/Essex 20 mm Russians and the Valiants are far bigger than them too, and seem slightly small next to the Dragon stuff(not bad though). The 28mm or 1/56 armor dwarfs the Valiant minis, looks downright weird to me. The 28mm miniatures are great with the 28mm vehicles, but don't mix in Valiants with that scale. If you go with bendy plastics or the smaller 20mm metals the Dragon and Valor armor will work fine (and look a bit big IMO) or stick with just Valiant minis matched with Valor/Dragon stuff.

Take away lesson, don't mix the scales.

It seems like the "true" 20mm is working with 1/76 or smaller 1/72 armor. The Valiant scale stuff is exactly 1" tall from bottom of boots to top of helmet (on one standing german infantryman with a MP40 from the first edition early german box set).

Just for the record. So,the sample Valiant I chose was 1" exactly. Therefore, 1"= 72" with helmet included equals 6 foot , which is tall for WWII but not unusual. It doesn't "go" with the 1/76 scale or 20mm scale stuff but Valiant looks excellent with Valor armor (and Dragon). Test it out yourself, get some test tanks and a cheap box of airfix style WWII minis, and a box of Valiants. See what looks good to you. Personally, I can't get the paint to stick well to the bendy plastics either, so I hate painting them. I much prefer Valiants to paint, 28mm to paint or 20mm metals for painting reasons too. Good luck and suit your own gaming needs.

i would agree forget the valiant figures , go for 20mm metal wargames figures and use the dragon , easymodel and forces of valor 1/72 armour .

I found the Valiant figures work fine with Dragon and Easymodel 1/72 armour, providing you mount your vehicles on bases the same thickness as the ones on your infantry.

I am now wargaming exclusively with the Valiant Miniatures and have found that the Armourfast (aka HaT) models are a good fit with the large scale 1/72 scale Valiant Miniatures. I also have some of the Italeri models that fit in rather well (i.e. GE PaK 40 ATG) with the Valiant Miniatures.

Furthermore, I have a few Dragon and Hobby Master models that are also a good fit and provide some interesting variety that currently the Armourfast models do not.

I also agree with peterx:

"The 28mm or 1/56 armor dwarfs the Valiant minis, looks downright weird to me. The 28mm miniatures are great with the 28mm vehicles, but don't mix in Valiants with that scale".

Dragonfan79
Try:
mibglobal.com.au

Cheers

1/72 vehicles are child size with Valiant figures. They are 28mm if you measure to the scalp as so many new gamers do when they come in from somewhere else. To an eyeballer it is 25mm.
They are neither 1/72 (1/72 space marines?) nor are they 20mm (unless there is now a third method of measuring, like to the nipple lol.)
PS I have some Armourfast and they suck something chronic. Not quite so bad are the Italeri Fast Assmeblies but they aren't quite there, I have their ISU-152 pack and they do not fit together at the back.
peterx: Americans must have been huge. Are we sure the average US trooper in WW2 wasn't a Juicer?

Personally, I can't get the paint to stick well to the bendy plastics either, so I hate painting them.

What paints do you use, out of curiosity? No one I know has ever had a problem with that using model paints such as Testors, Tamiya, Gunze-Sangyo, Humbrol.
--
Tim

Are they older kits? I read that the older figs are made of a plastic with no valencies left on the molecule to bond with a paint molecule. The same as plastic toy army men.
The bending wouldn't help either.

Dragonfan79 – The difference between 1/76 (Airfix and matchbox) and 1/72 (everyone else) is very, very small. So I wouldn't worry about it too much. If you want to use Valiant figures go for it. I would recommend Italeri and Revell for reasonably priced model vehicles which are very good.

With bendy plastic you need to wash them thoroughly in warm water + detergent ( the stuff you wash dishes with ).
Then prime with PVA.
With this there's a technique works best.
You thin the PVA slightly and more sort of smear it on with a big soft brush. 2 thin layers work best as the first one will likely not cover properly.
You can then paint with acrylics, varnish and it doesn't come off any more than from metal.
Bend a metal barrel back and forth a few times and not only will the paint come off, so will the barrel.

There are two "real" downsides to bendy plastic.
1) The poses and weapons are often rather an odd mix – way more machine guns than rifles for example.
2) The flash can be a bitch to remove until you get the hang of it.

It's a pity Caesar don't do more ww2 figures. Their germans are pretty good but the weapon mix is very limiting.
The modern US infantry I have are very nice – for plastics.

Really though, you're way better getting AB. Those are the rolls royce of ww2 figures and maybe a bit pricey but excellent figures.

Excellent vehicles:
The newer revell and Dragon 1/72 plastic kits. ( Although many plastic kits are very good ).
MMS metal 1/76.
Milicast ( they do a combat ready ).
Cromwell – although customer service is allegedly not their strength.

If you want cheap then frontline – but remember you get what you pay for.

If you want to build quick but later phase out your cheap stuff then those Italeri where you get a high quality kit plus a quick build version for the price of one high quality kit are a good option.

ditto bird-i use gw paints with some others in the mix. It peels off or rubs off when I game with them. I just play the bendy plastics unpainted or minimally painted.
AONeill- perhaps I'm too lazy to do all those steps for so-so plastic sculpts. I've done some of it and it didn't help. Thanks for the tips, none-the-less.
chironex- a WWII re-enactor told me the average U.S. G.I. was 5'8" and weighed 150 lb. or so. Then, in his helmet and boots maybe 5'9"/5'10" or so, so 6 ft. isn't far off (to the top of the helmet). A tall G.I. could be 5'10" easy, 6 in boots and helmet. Heck, my grandfather was 6'2", he was an Air Force Col. in WWII.

There are two steps to getting bendy plastic ready.
Wash.
Prime.
It doesn't take me significantly longer than metals or I'd not bother.
Similarly, some plastics are indeed so-so. Others are pretty good. I don't bother with the so-so ones.

personally use valiant next to the plastic kits from italeri, hat, pegasus and revell/unimodel to a lesser extent. The valiant figures are big, but I find the some of 1/72 figures out there a bit small anyway. If they were correct to scale I would question their robustness for gaming.

the downside with Valiant in my opinion, is not so much larger adaptable multipose figures but the small size of the range – no russians, british/us/german paras – which means they have to be mixed with other figures.

Say what you will, but I have some at home and compared them to other items all over my desk and found they are closer to GZG 25mm Stargrunt figures than 1/72.
"You guys getting any cover there?"
picture
"But sir, that tank's being driven by kids!"
picture
Is it just me, or is the commander of this M113 variant the same size as a Valiant figure?
picture
"No, seriously- how are we supposed to get in this thing?"
picture
Introducing the M113a3 from Trumpeter, sometimes known as the "Rhino"-
picture

Doors look a bit small on this one.
picture

Holy frak chironex, those are big, big figures.

I was very disappointed with the pictures of the Valiants. They posted to a number of Yahoo groups talking about their plans and it sounded really exciting. When they released pictures of the figures, it wasn't so much the size that disappointed me as it was the big honking weapons on some of the figures. I rolled my eyes and said "oh great, 28mm in 1:72 scale…"
--
Tim

I even painted most of a box of Valiant Brits before I realised they just weren't going to go with anything else I'd got. They made my SHQ stuff look like 15mm!

Valiants go fairly well with the Ready to Roll stuff (which is also a very bloated '1/72nd').

Dunno about that mate.
Which ready to roll range?

If you wanted to and were worried about vehicle scale issues then, Berlin or Bust series of vehicles are small 1/60 and don't really fit with my 28mm stuff. If you can find it, maybe online, buy one and put it together to test it out. Maybe they would work with Valiant's larger scale. I still like Forces of Valour Tanks and Dragon fine with my Valiant stuff.

sandsmodels.com/page2.html
These should work.
Was going to buy a Dragon kit this weekend anyway, but if it is worth the price that means it bloody should be the scale it says on the box, what with all the sophistication of the kits so I hold out no hope of it working.

Wait, I have a couple I haven't touched yet, let's see…

Love the Valiants. They look fine with FOV or Dragon tanks and half tracks. They work fine with ArmorFast. They paint nicely and you can customize poses very easily (and more importantly to me – quickly). However, I started out with them, so I don't have a collection of 20mm metal or other "bendy" plastics. The Valiants and FOV cheap painted tanks are what got me to try 20mm gaming (or whatever scale you want to call it. It's way bigger than 15mm and way smaller than 28mm).
The other plastics mentioned – esp. Ceasar are very good. I just like the look of the Valiants more. Plus the boxes are "built" for Rapid Fire – so that's nice too.

BC

Valiant and a Revell Cromwell.

picture

Hope this helps, Michael in Abbotsford.