"Battle of Barossa (Chiclana) 1811" Topic

Dear all,

I am trying to establish what artillery , number and type fought at Barossa.
I undertsand the Anglo-allied forces had ten pieces Under major Duncan and of these 2 were Howitzers and four were six pounders. What did the French have, what are your sources?
I do understand from oman volume IV that a Leval had six pieces and that two were captured from Ruffin on the heights (one Howitzer the other unknown.
Is it correct to assume aside from Howitzers that they were all six pounders.
Were the French batteries foot batteries?

I look forward to hearing from you.

Ausrobal

My source, uses Oman, Martinien and Charrie..
It doesn't go into too great a detail im afraid but it does say the French have 4 Foot Artillery batteries, totalling 24 guns. It doesn't specify type im afraid.

Of these 5 guns are recorded as being captured.

For the British I have 10 Guns, same as you.

Hi Edwulf,

Thank you, that confirms the total number available, but I am not clear if this was all witH Leval and Ruffin. For sure Villatte had some and there must have been quite a bit shoved into the siege works. However Leval was outnumbered 10 guns to the French SIX, 3 of whcih were captured as that division retreated.
Ruffin lost a Howitzer and another gun on the hill top as the French retreated again with that division,
AT a push this accounts for 6 of the 8 named piecesdefinitly on the field, but that would leave 16 pieces unaccounted for.
Lets assume Villatte had at least 6 pieces that still leaves 10 unaccounted for. If all 3 divisions had the same number of batteries and this equuated to six guns a piece then we are still looking only at 18 pieces. So where did the other 6 of the 24 mentioned go?

I appreciate that this is a bit detailed, it just struck me as odd that this detail is missing in all surviving documents.

I am trying to recreate this battle in miniature 15mm scale, AB and hence my questions.

If anyone else can help it would be greatly appreciated.

All the best, Robert

According to The History of the Royal Regiment of Artillery, there were six French pieces captured at Barrosa; two 7 inch howitzers, three 8 pounders and one 4 pounder complete with ammunition wagons and horses. The authority for this is a letter from Major Duncan to General Graham.

Also of possible interest from Major Duncan's report:

"On the 21st we sailed from Cadiz, embarking our three Brigades, viz. Captain Hughes, with three six pounders and one Howitzer; Captain Roberts with the same, and Captain Gardiner with three nine pounders and a howitzer. From our scarcity of horses and the necessity of attaching six to each six pounder & its Carriages, and eight to each nine pounder, we were obliged thus to curtail the Brigades. On the 25th and 26th, the army arrived and landed at Algeciras and proceeded to Tarifa, the road to which being impracticable for Artillery, the guns and horses went round by sea, and the Detachments marched. As many mules as we could get together here in addition to our horses, were embarked for the conveyance of our reserve gun ammunition and that for the troops, trusting that as we advanced in the country we might purchase or procure others, but in this I was disappointed, so much so as to be obliged to leave at Tarifa a gun from each of the six pounder brigades [confirmed in a footnote as 2 x 6 pounders] the General being particularly desirous that the nine pounders should move complete in order to forward a sufficient quantity of rifle and musquet ammunition."

Captain Snort,

Thank you for this, this is really useful. Does the History of the Royal Regiment of Artillery say where the second Howitzer was captured, was this from leval's artillery or from Ruffin's?

So basically we can say for sure that Duncan actually had 3 x 9Ibers, 4 X 6Ibers and 3 Howitzers. A total of 10 guns.

Presumably the French 4Ib and Howitzers were up the hill as they would have been easier to negotiate over rough land up there?

All the best, Ausrobal

Ausrobal,

Neither the History of the Royal Regiment of Artillery, nor the report of Duncan state where these guns were captured. There are several eyewitness accounts that do throw some light on this however.

Regarding the howitzers, they are mentioned by three participants so we can be fairly certain that one was captured from each battery; Gough says that his regiment, the 87th, captured a howitzer during the conflict with the 45th ligne of Leval's division. This is supported by Surtees of the 95th who fought on the same flank. The other howitzer was captured on the hill occupied by Ruffin, and Blakeney, who served with Browne's flank battalion, claims to have inscribed "28th Regiment" on this weapon with some earth. Two other guns were captured late in the battle in a charge of the KGL Hussars but I am not certain about the remaining two, although most primary sources say that 6 guns were taken.

I have seen the amount of French guns in the action (ie those with Ruffin and Leval) variously described in secondary sources as either 12 or 14, while Blakeney describes a battery of 8 guns with Ruffin's division. I suppose it is possible that one French division had a battery of 4 pounders plus howitzers, and the other a battery of 8 pounders plus howitzers, although it is equally possible that both batteries were mixed.

Barrosa is an interesting battle to research. There are, for example, at least 3 eyewitness accounts that have the French of Leval fighting in line rather than "the usual column of divisions" stated in later works, which is rather remininscent of the Maida controversy.

Hi there Captain Snort,

I have Blackeney's book and you are right he does state that he got 8 to 10 Grenadiers of the 28th and charged at bayonet the Howitzer whiklst it was being loaded, it being taken at bayonet point and he does indeed state he marked it with chalky earth for the 28th. he also confirms that Duncan had ten guns.

You are probably right that eye witness accounts are the best bet for any info. Odd though that Oman states the French had 24 guns in total. Do you think this includes pieces used in the siege works?

Thank you for this, absolutely fascinating, The Battle of Maida is also another I am very interested in.

All the best,
Ausrobal