"HELP - MEDIA WANT TO FILM IN OUR CLUB" Topic

True, but why give them the chance to engage in that debate?

Club: Sorry, we couldn't get a consensus of the members.
TV guy: …

A big part of successfully engaging media is to give answers that foreclose any opportunity for "follow-up".

Your conversation would go like this:

Club: We think you'll portray us in a bad light.
TV guy: No, no, nothing could be further from the truth.
Club: Sorry, seen too much reality TV to believe that.
TV guy: No really, we're quite different. Don't worry. We give you our word on it.
Club: Ummmm…

In the example above, it's the club that comes across as being unreasonable, not the TV guy. Saying "we think you'll portray us negatively" implies that there is something negative there already that you want to keep concealed.

Why give them an opportunity to engage on the issue if your answer is going to be "no"? Better to just give an answer that forecloses further discussion.

Cheers

w.

The real question here is what's in it for you guys?

How about a sign on the door:

Quarantined for head lice, SARS, and a really virulent groin rash outbreak'

You could tell them that bright lights hurt gamers eyes since they don't emerge to often from their parent's basement (more a US excuse, I guess -so maybe garden shed?).

or to put gamers in a better light:

No gaming tonight, nice weather, were spending the night with our families/playing [active sport]/volunteering – or all three. Which in fairness, many gamers do actually opt out because of this.

You could also camp it up by wearing powder blue Goering outfits and refer to each other as Reichsbahnfuhrer Reg or Cyril and do 'the Ministry of Silly Walks' bit and tell the funniest joke in the world while gaming. Having strippers in Nazi Uniforms would be a nice touch too.

Gamer X dragged you all into this, he should figure out how to get you out. But suggesting a better venue for the film crew would be best – Gamer X's home, a convention, or just a photo of his completely immoral and twisted Army -that should be enough grist for the mill?

Just say no.

Say no

Or, if yo must say yes, have a big screen and project old episodes of "A Game of war", shown on C4 and featuring that nice newsreader lady who used to have the legs

As somebody who spent ten years working as a PR consultant I wouldn't touch them with somebody else's bargepole.

I suggest you don't even say we couldn't reach consensus, as that suggests that some of the members find issue. The "we have people under 18/16/whatever it is in england here and we're not going to toss them out for you" is a much better excuse, unless the UK doesn't have a law that says minors can't enter into legal contracts.

Well.

Got to the club and they were waiting outside.

I will, as I said, have to ask the members, and if anyone says no, you can't film.

I walk in, and start asking – and turn round, there they are, filming.

Ummm you realise I said no filming in here? We have not signed any release forms?

They give me a release form, assure me they will only be filming X and his opponent, who is happy to play. I read the release form and realise that as I rent the place from an organisation who have NOT been asked, i can use that as a reason to refuse them entry politely – 'sorry, but it says here I have authority to let you in to film, and I don't'. I turn round to say this and they are on a table, filming us.

Out they go, sans release forms.

Twats.

Pat

They got enough footage – it will be used. Trust me on this one. They just need to show X and some dice and figures on the board.

Sorry, it's a cheap shot that the American news crews use all the time. They already have X's approval to be filmed. And if they do not mention your club or the location, then they are ok.

Eject, Mailman, eject!

Wow, thats dick. Well, when they put it on tv… first make sure you record it (so you can put it on youtube :D ), and then scan it carefully to make sure that only the opponent(whom I am assuming did sign a release) and the dude who the show is about are the ones in the film. If anyone else at all or anything identifying the store is, press charges like its going out of style!

You'll know if they think you're dodgy, C4 will send in Jon Ronson.

Bloody hell, Pat – those sound like the most unprofessional bucnh of jerks to ever grace a TV company!

What was the name of the indie company doing this? It might be worth a complaint to Channel 4 about their behaviour.

chaos0xomega – it could take 3 to 4 years for a case like that to go thru the civil courts here, so it probably isn't worth the hassle to Pat.

However… Pat could scare the living daylights out of the indie company by casually mentioning the names of all the miniature manufacturers whose products they have just filmed, and asking if they have copyright cleared them for UK standard and non-standard TV transmission.

That's Gonna work? Excuse me – do you have permission from Porsche to film my car?

Let's not turn this into an IP thread.

In the end, noone really gives a damn if they do film us, and if they portray us as slavering Nazis I don't think anybody will care (actually The Polsh members might. And the Jewish one may well find it hilarious) what bothered me was giving them _permission_ to make us look like s. At least this way we can say 'They filmed us without permission, and those were not Nazi Salutes we were giving – we were Shouting 'Get off that ing table and off out of the club now!'

Pat

Soooo, the moral of this story is that you don't have any right NOT to be filmed if your bouncer is the one who lets them in!

Sane Max said: "That's Gonna work? Excuse me – do you have permission from Porsche to film my car?"

Yes, actually it can. There is a famous BBC tale of someone who shot an interview in an art gallery and then discovered it was completely untransmittable because of all the paintings they'd have to clear copyright on.

If their prog is not:
a) news or other current affairs prog that's "in the public interest"
b) a review about wargaming or miniatures
c) an incidental use covered by fair dealing (e.g. a porsche driving by, a miniature on shelf in the background)
…then technically they have to check and clear it all. e.g. close ups of the Porsche logo would definitely count.

Some won't bother and Porsche/Games Workshop won't notice or won't care.
Some won't bother and will get sued.

I still think you should email Channel 4 and tell them the company blackening their name are a bunch of s.

Sane Max I have to agree with Stronty Girl. Send the suits at Channel 4 an email pointing out the thouroghly unproffesional and disrespectful behavior of the film crew. If the mention of the name of your club and members are portrayed in a bad light that a barrister will be contacting them. If this doesn't disuade them follow through and sue the jerks for defamation.
As for member X the fact that he let them film anyway despite being told No by the majority shows he has ho respect for your club members. If your club does not have a set of bylaws and rules of behaviour now may be a good time. Its up to you and your fellow club members on how to deal with him.
I once belonged to a club where one club member physically assaulted another. He was kicked out for his unacceptable behaviour. We did not have bylaws or a code of conduct. We would game at a members home and had decided his house, his rules. After this incident we drew up a set of rules of conduct. Unfortunately it took a major breach of civilised behaviour to set it in motion. Its up to you and your fellow club. Anyway just putting in my two cents. Good luck

Bruce the Texas Grognard

As I said, Gamer X got you into this mess.

Pat, to finish your saga off, how did member X react to the not filming decision?
I think part of your feelings in this issue was a desire not to alienate a friend.
Id guess that even if he s mad now after the Reality program screws him over he ll decide you guys did the right thing.

For God's sake don't use the "We have under-16s who can't be filmed" line, or you'll find yourself on the sharp end of a Channel Four News report, exposing "an evil group of warmongers who run a youth group without any of their staff having undergone the legally-required CRB checks…"

(CRB=Criminal Records Bureau – a governmental organisation that checks the background of people – particularly those working with youngsters and/or vulnerable adults)

Member X was fine about it. I took the chance to ask him about the show, and it is clearly going to be exploitative tat, but he is getting paid lots to do it, and is the sort of man who could not give a damn about his reputation. The TV company chose him when they were at a Biker Rally and saw him in a monster punch-up at the end of which he was last man standing and was asking his girlfriend to pull a Flicknife he couln't reach out of his lower shoulder…. so they clearly were'nt looking to make anything too educational.

Pat

And we ain't got no under-16's in our club, or x would have been banned from membership anyway – far too foul-mouthed
Pat

Would I be right in thinking that member x wins lots of games in your club Pat?

Should have seen about arranging for it to be 'Pokemon Night' or something equally silly.

The press over on this side of the puddle is just as bad. I haven't had any direct experience, but I've been told by those who do that the *best* thing you can do is offer a *guided* tour, with lots of explanations, and answering questions. Often times, a given reporter may not be familiar with whatever hobby or event they're filming, and bringing them up to date (while carefully avoiding info overload) on the basics will often cause them to paint the whole thing in a better light.

Of course, filming permission and releases need to be there, but you should be more 'concerned about possible liability' rather than 'angry/offended at the filming'.

If you were *really* feeling gutsy, you could have offered to let the reporters play a few rounds, or at least have them sit through a game and explain it as you go.

To Member X: "So.. since you made a huge wad of cash on this, I guess you wouldn't mind, say, bringing a few beers by for the next couple sessions?"

Member x once tried leaning over someone while suggesting his interpretation of a rule was correct, but got very short shrift. Some things are more important than losing teeth.

He is actually pretty well behaved. Just foul-mouthed and forthright.

Pat

It would have been funny if everyone spoke in phrases a la Madaxeman's wargaming phrase generator. To late now,maybe next time.

I remember the BBC 'documentary' about a WW2 reenactment group that claimed some members were- shock!- racist and had right wing views!

Much the same of course could be said of most golf clubs, pubs and bus queues. John Sweeney set out to show that the German reenactors were nazis- I don't recall him asking the US Airborne reenactors if they held the same views on racial segregation that held sway in the US in the 1940's.

I took a five year old to the Military History day out in question and he had a great time. People were invariably friendly and he got to dress up in WW2 British steel helmet, webbing and hold a Lee Enfield.

Unfortunately the media are only interested in sneering in a condescending, patronising manner at groups of people actually DOING something in their evenings or weekends, then wring their hands about the state of the nation when people throw up in the streets, become obese through inactivity or have no interests, general knowledge, hobbies or sense of history.

Avoid!

link

I work for an independent video production company in the U.S. I am a producer of corporate and idustrial training programs for over 20 years. Stronty Girl is correct. This crew is a bunch of unprofessional idiots.

I know personally that many (not all) news organizations are scum bags. They never, and I mean never, show gamers/ fringe hobbies in a positive light. I grew up in Milwaukee WI. Gen-Con was held here for many years. The local news organizations were always trying to play up the perceived "devil worshiping" aspect of the games.

These crews always interviewed gamers in costumes and ignored the average-dressed person attending the Con. The cameramen always interviewed the one or two protesters that showed up for the first hour of the convention. (as if they were there for days)These producers also concentrated the coverage on the LARPers, and ignored the more mundane gamers.

Bottom line: the crews edited all the footage together to manufacture some sort of controversy. When TSR/Wizards complained the coverage got more light-hearted.

These same local news organizations went nuts when GEN-CON moved to Indy.

You guys didn't stand a chance. They will shoot first and put together whatever they want later.

The TV Show was on last night – 'Make me a Christian' on Channel 4 – exploitative Tat of the usual type. Our club was not shown, thank the Lord*.

Martin came across as a foul-mouthed, irritating and intimidating thug, who nonetheless says what he thinks, and may be right too. That was a pretty fair portrayal!

*The LandLord

Pat