"The Perfect Renaissance Rules" Topic

I've read various threads about several different rule sets and I'm interested to hear from everybody about what rules for Renaissance you think are the best and why?

After reading The Art of War in the 16th Century by Oman I went out and got the Warfare in the Age of Discovery rules. The main reason is that the combat was chaotic and units broke, succeeded, or sat still for the strangest reasons, more so than in other periods. The combat and morale tables reflect this with the +/- die roll which represents these wild swings of fortune that were a recurring theme on renaissance battlefields. The rules represent what I feel a battlefield of that era would look like, but others will certainly disagree as the period, much like ancients, is open to wide interpretation.

Never tried AoD but I do have them. I found the prescribed formations a little bit intimidating. Especially if you are playing with Spanish. Same goes for PoW, although I use them for 15mm TYW. I suppose, if you found the mechanics of those rules acceptable, you could "house rule" the formations.

I'm currently giving DBR v2.0 a go, but I can't say they would be my first choice, if it wasn't for the other club members playing them.

There certainly isn't one answer to your questions. I, and many others I suspect, would probably see the time-span (16th & 17th centuries) as at least two seperate periods. But then you would probably get people arguing about where the split is!

In the latest Arquebusier (P&SS journal) there is an article by someone asking almost the same question. He ended up going back to Gush v2.0 with other local gamers just to have fun.

I think it is a case of try them all and see which one suits you best. I am kean to try Maximillian! and Barded Fury (from the Amblers Gamers Yahoo Group), to play the Italian Wars.

You might consider the newly published "Impetus" rules from the Italian magazine Dadi e Piombo. They flow nicely, have several intersting nuances, include special rules for the coordination of pike and shot, and the rulebook includes army lists for renaissance French and Imperials.

I do like the AoD rules- especially for the way they 'model' the halberds, sword and bucklers and, if attached, arquebusiers. Very neat. A good sized 20 to 30 point army can be made fairly inexpensively AND is a great way to resurrect my minifigs, hinchliffes and Ral Parthas.

"Renaissance Warfare" by Terry Gore. Its the Renaissance version of his popular "Medieval Warfare" rules.

I actually use "Medieval Warfare" for 16th century armies and it works just fine.

Maximillian is a good fun set of rules (from the DBA stable but with period flavour)

As for the best, I would say Band of Brothers from the Piquet system, BUT you have to like the mayhem that is Piquet, suits the period perfectly IMHO.

If you are looking for late 16th century rules try The Perfect Captain's "Spanish Fury" rules. There's also a great Yahoo support group.

I've looked at Maximillian! and liked particularly the melee but didn't feel the game had enough depth for what I wanted.

I was impressed with my recent acquisition of Impetus. Like the command structure among other things. I look forward to them expanding their lists

I'd love to look at Band of Brothers 2 but can't find anyone in the UK who stocks it.

I'm doing mainly early to mid 16th Century and was interested that some people go as far as considering one rule set for 16th Century and one for 17th Century.

Being as I'm getting on in years, I still think Gush's WRG rules are a fine set.Similar, but a little more involved, are Tercio.

"Perfect", you lost me in the title. Wouldn't "perfect rules" have me win everytime I do everything right? Not in this world, bucko.

Gush, on the other hand is no longer "getting on in years" is he? I am amazed that someone dead can still influence the hobby so much.

Have AoD, they seem like they have alot of flavor but also look "clunky", maybe I should try them. I am going with Maximilian, enough fun and have playability too.

George Gush is not dead, at least he wasn't a couple of months ago because I saw him at Cavalier. I'd still play his Renaissance rules if I could persuade anybody else to do so.

I found second hand copy of the Gush rules and the armies lists and they certainly do seem to capture the flavour of the period well. We have used Forlorn Hope which is very realistic but too slow. WECW which I like but most felt used too many dice. 1644 which is a good fun game. Looked at DBR and hated it but I do not like DBM so unlikely to be swayed. I intend to use Gush for Italian wars. Had a copy of Foundry Medieval rules and the Renaissance Playsheets and they look good but unit sizes were too small for me. I am going for 64 figure pike blocks which I think Gush suits well. May try them for ECW as well