"Russian Guard Artillerymen Uniforms" Topic
11 Posts
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Lest We Forget | 03 Mar 2008 1:24 p.m. PST |
Can anyone confirm the uniforms of the Russian Guard (foot and horse) artillerymen? Were there major differences between the 1805-1807 period and the 1812 period? There is a trouser color difference between drivers and gunners. I've run across sources that list white or gray trousers for the gunners. Did any of them have a red stripe on their trousers? Any information would be welcome. |
nvrsaynvr | 04 Mar 2008 9:03 a.m. PST |
That's a big question. The L.G. Foot Artillery generally followed the Line with the usual guard distinctions: reddish brass metal work Guard eagle plate above crossed cannons for the shako Round plate with embossed eagle for the cartridge pouch Yellow boutonnieres, two pair on the collar, 3 on each cuff patch. In addition, they had metal chinscales for the shako, and wore white pants in summer and white with black leggings in the winter. The best place for details about the line artillery is Mark Conrad's Russian page. The L.G. Horse Artillery is more complicated, as they moved to Mounted Jaeger dress in 1812. I will offer more later. NSN |
Lest We Forget | 04 Mar 2008 11:48 a.m. PST |
NSN: Thanks for the info. I still can't find confirmation details about trouser color for line and horse gunners for pre-1812 and 1812 and after. I've found some sources where the trousers are gray at one point (1812 and after?) and another source that notes the drivers were gray. When the horse gunners went to the "jaeger" uniform did that include a red striped down the side? I can't seem to find these details in any of the sources. Thanks again |
nvrsaynvr | 04 Mar 2008 8:43 p.m. PST |
The pants of the line foot were gray in summer and, after 1809 dark green winter pants. The LG Guard apparently kept white pants for both. This all from Viskovatov with the help of Conrand and Zweguintzow. NSN |
Lest We Forget | 04 Mar 2008 8:46 p.m. PST |
NSN: Thanks. Trying to get specific details for them has been difficult. I found one reference (but did not list originating source) that in 1812 the Guard foot artillerymen had gray trousers. |
von Winterfeldt | 04 Mar 2008 11:25 p.m. PST |
a pity un ami isn't here at the moment, hopefully he has not elft the board. |
nvrsaynvr | 05 Mar 2008 7:33 a.m. PST |
Well, what is that source? NSN |
nvrsaynvr | 05 Mar 2008 11:11 a.m. PST |
Here is the bit from Viskovatov about the L.G.Horse new uniformss: 2 Февраля 1811 – Гвардейской Конной Артиллерiи повелено иметь: 1) Вместо касокъ, кивера, такiе же, какъ у Гвардейской Пешей Артиллерiи, но съ белымъ, а у трубачей съ краснымъ, волосянымъ султаномъ, имевшимъ къ корню черный волосъ, съ примесью оранжеваго, причемъ состоявшiе въ унтеръ-офицерскихъ чинахъ отличались черною, съ оранжевымъ, верхушкою (Рис. №№ 2187 и 2188). 2) Вместо белыхъ панталонъ съ высокими сапогами, темнозеленыя, длинныя панталоны или чакчиры съ красными выкладками или лампасами и съ такою же выпушкою, по образцу уланскихъ чакчиръ, и такiе же, какъ у уланъ, сапоги (Рис. №№ 2187 и 2188). 3) вместо палашей сабли, одного образца съ уланскими (Рис. №№ 2187 и 2188). 4) На вальтрапахъ нижнихъ чиновъ, вместо одного ряда краснаго съ желтыми клетками, два ряда желтаго, безъ клетокъ, басона, нашитаго по черной, съ красными выпушками, выкладке (Рис. № 2187) (92). As you can see, the gray overalls had red piping on the seam and a red stripe on either side of the piping. It appears that when the line got the uniform, after the fall of Paris, the piping was black. NSN |
Lest We Forget | 05 Mar 2008 1:52 p.m. PST |
NSN: Thanks. The character set appears corrupted on one through four above. Your concluding paragraph reads okay. The source was a Web painting/uniform site that I have to look up again, but I traced down the source that they used to Alexander Mikaberidze's Web site of Russian uniforms. On his site there is a picture of a Russian Guard Artillery officer (in gray trousers) and an artilleryman in white trousers. The NapoleonGuide.com site, under Russian infantry uniforms shows a Russian Guard artilleryman in the Jaeger (green) uniform (but doesn't give the year as far as I can tell). |
Lest We Forget | 05 Mar 2008 2:06 p.m. PST |
Von W: I agree. Un Ami is always helpful and a gentleman. I hope that his recent distasteful experience on another thread did not sour him permanently! The value of his contributions to wargaming, uniforms, and history are exponentially higher than the hyperbole of the insolant and arrogant persona on that thread. |
nvrsaynvr | 05 Mar 2008 8:36 p.m. PST |
(You need to set your browser encoding to Windows Cyrillic. There is probably a way for me to transform it into real Unicode, but I haven't figured it out yet
) Very interesting! The cards are from Parkhayev, who is current and quite reliable. But he also illustrated a book Russkaya Armiya 1812-1814 that uses all his cards. And
yes the picture of the L.G.Foot Artilleryman has been modified to show white pants with black leggings! So I guess that is resolved. Note that officers were equipped with mid-gray coveralls since 1802, so might always be in gray. NSN |
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