"Wither the Friendly Local Hobby Store?" Topic

I just wrote an editorial on the demise of the FLHS:

kraftcreation.blogspot.com

Comments welcome.

Whither the Friendly Local Hobby Store?

Withering on the vine by the sound of it … :-)

The internet killed them.

Its a trend for the past…what, two decades?

The internet is the obvious culprit, with companies operating on leaner margins able to offer lower prices. R/C airplanes suffer from this as much or more than gaming does.

I deal with a lot of hobby stores as part of my job. It saddens me to see so many on hard times. I do wonder if it's just an old business model which needs updating. Like the local game store, the ones which thrive do so very well.

Console games and Home PCs. Computers eat more time from kids than you expect.

The Internet does not kill FLG/HS. People who don't know how to run them kill FLG/HS (although usually they're ULG/HS.

Look at the shops that are doing well; they're usually *using* the Internet, for heaven's sake.

Allen

I agree. The ones that are doing well are very much in tune with what the customer wants and needs. They also have their own website, forum, etc.

I was just down to Dragonhead Distributors in Emmaus, PA, right outside of Allentown yesterday.
He is the East Coast distributor and convention presence for Minifigs USA. I think.
So, his store is already supported by a business.
In addition the owner is a REAL businessman from way back.
He has gaming tables in the store, and a strong local gaming community.

If anyone can make it happen, this guy can. It's only an hour from me, and our club has hard core regulars that travel further than that to Scranton.

In my opinion, you need several things:
You must already know how to run a business. Putting a "Welcome to the Games Workshop Hobby!" introductory stocking order on your girlfriend's VISA card shows you do not. (Another sad local story…)
Thinking that the fact that you love 40K and can get it at a discount now is s similar failing.
You must have a strong MATURE local gaming group.
You must treat your regulars like you are glad to see them come in.
You must not let paying customers fume at the cash register while you continue your computer game in plain sight of said customer.
You must not giggle to same paying customer that there is no Chaos Black in stock on the sheves 'cuz all the guys in the gback took it for their own painting.

But you knew that already.

I never had a really good local hobby store until I moved to Helsinki (a drastic colution, I admit).

Within a ten minute walk there is 1) a well-stocked combo GW/Other Popular Minis/Boardgames/Cards/Comics (and historical rules) shop, with table space and a staff that will special order for you, 2) a small "real" GW store, and 3) a huge all-around hobby store that stocks a bewildering array of craft goods and models, paints, plastic soldiers, etc. Then, you can hop on a tram for 10 minutes and get to 4) a little shop that is wall-to-wall models and plastic soldiers.

Of course, I order most of my miniatures via email …

But I'm a historical gamer with niche interests, and more important is the fact that my son has really taken to the plastic soldiers and models, and if I were a sci-fi/fantasy/GW type, I would be in hog heavan. There must be something to the combination of a fairly captive market and a wide range of stock.

Cheers,

Christopher

PS – I forgot about the other store that solely stocks boardgames, including a wide variety of wargames.

Ah – treat the "c" in "colution" as a lunate sigma.

I would shop more at my FLGS if they supported miniature more. They are predominately a gaming store, so bored games, rpg's and the fad games (read clicky, magic, cards) are given equal if not more space. The supplies are getting better, but no historicals of any sort.

Honestly, I feel like train stores are always run better. I often buy from train/model stores with a very small selection of miniatures than I do game stores.

We look to sell things specifically that are NOT at the big box stores or Franchise hobby stores. So we sell a lot of boardgames, but not those you find at Target or Toy R Us. We sell puzzles, but only high quality and mostly imports from Europe. We sell chess, but all good stuff. We also sell historical miniatures, which are a big part of our sales. Finally, we have a lot of in-store gamiing in dedicated gaming space.

We also sell on the internet. Internet sales are 15% – 20% of our revenue. But more importantly, the web sites serve as advertising. Austin is a wired city. When we ask new customers how they found us, by far, "the internet" is the most common response.

Granted, we can't match the prices of on-line discounters, but people can come there, pick up the games, ask questions, and walk out with it (or sit down and play). For many, that is worth the extra few bucks. And we do have a customer reward system in place to give back to loyal customers.

We are continuing to grow. So, while the internets have made it more difficult in some ways, they have opened other, new opportunities as well.

Rob

"The internet killed them".

That, and the fact that most don't carry any decent historical miniatures anymore, so can't get my business because of that.

My FLGS – Phoenix Games in Minneapolis – just closed its doors last month, although Neal is opening a smaller store in a farther-out suburb and concentrating more on internet sales. As he told me 'the gentrification of Lake Street killed us' – Phoenix Games was in a slightly seedy part of south Minneapolis which has lately seen an upsurge of condos, coffee shops, and upscale restaurants, and the landlord for Phoenix Games thought he could get more rent from another tenant. Very sad! The only other store in the Cities that I frequent is the Source – and that is on the other side of the collapsed 35W bridge!!!

Anyway to get back to the original topic – even thought my FLGS had a lot of sales, and a 10% frequent buyer discount, I still found myself doing more shopping online, just couldn't beat the 20-30% off I could usually get online. Of course if I now find I need a certain bottle of paint, or a new brush, or that one particular figure that I can't wait a week for UPS for, I am now out of luck!!!!

I think the FLHS will survive. They just need to roll with the punches. One of the problems I encounter are owners who have just given up hope. It's not as if they inherited the store; in some cases they've been in the business for years. But a lot of them were slow to adapt with the Internet.

I'm publishing the more interesting comments from other web board on the demise of the local hobby shop on my blog:
kraftcreation.blogspot.com

That, and the fact that most don't carry any decent historical miniatures anymore, so can't get my business because of that.

I know one store that has basically given up on historicals* due to the fact that historical manufacturers and distributors have given up on him. Meaning they don't offer decent terms for him to buy their products anymore or the order turnaround takes weeks. He's gone so far as to recommend that I, a paying customer, look at other alternative retailers for historical gaming beyond 15mm WWII.

Also, since the store's customers don't buy historicals, excepting Flames of War products, on anything like a regular basis it's not worth it for him to continue to keep so much in stock. So he's cutting back the inventory and ordering less frequently, which means fewer special orders, etc. So he's basically quit selling historicals. Special orders have dried up anyway since distributors/manufacturers either can't supply the product in a timely manner or have quit offering terms that are acceptable to a retailer so he doesn't want to leave customers hanging for weeks/months waiting for something.

Now, this is a store that's been in business since 1987 and is doing well otherwise. I figure this is a "phase" and he'll swing back around to offering more historical products as the industry allows and customers demand. I haven't talked to him in a month so I'm hoping this will change sooner than later.

*He wants to stock historicals and has done since since the store's inception. But Flames of War, some books and Warhammer Ancient Battles publications are going to be about it for that store regarding historicals.

Carrying historical minis has almost become a labour of love for most retailers. There is just so much stuff out there, you can't stock it all and because of all the different periods and interests, carrying any depth is almost impossible. I have about $150,000 in historical minis in stock and it barely scratches the surface.

The only reason I can do this is because we have a lot of space and I carry RPGs, Wargames, CCGs, Anime, Eurogames, etc. The breadth of selection is what makes it possible and brings customers in. Even so, I'm out of room (and I've got 13,000 sq.ft.) The other factor is that we own our own building and I just have to depend on the games to break even. The real estate is where the profit will be.

Most FLHS can't do this. It's not a business model that should work. Sometimes I wonder why it does for us?

Gord

I always try to buy from my local game/hobby store. Though it might be a bit more expensive it doesn´t matter. Yes I "loose" a few dollars but I can live with that. What i want is a nice store where I can hang out and talk with friends, actually handle products and look through rules before buying them. If I have to pay a few more dollars for that compared with buying on the net, then I´m willing to pay that.

I can afford it and the "value" I get from having that nice store is worth alot more than saving a few bucks and buying on the internet. I buy from the net also but only products that the store does not have. I spend maybe 100 USD on wargaming products each month and on that I might save 5-10 if I only ordered on the net and if that meant "my" hobbystore would fold then it is not worth it.

I know one store that has basically given up on historicals due to the fact that historical manufacturers and distributors have given up on him. Meaning they don't offer decent terms for him to buy their products anymore or the order turnaround takes weeks.

And this, in my snotty opinion is why the historical miniatures hobby is in such straits: The while 'industry' needs a massive injection of professionalism. More than once I've made orders for specific stuff from specific manufacturers at my local FLGS (The Last Square in Madison, Wisconsin. Plug! Plug!) only to get told things like 'They told us they don't make that model any more' (then why do they still have it in their catalog?) 'they're not shipping to retailers' (then they don't want customers to buy their products?) and so on.

One of the reasons that LGS in the UK are suffering is the sheer number of wargames shows!

You could go to one every other weekend of the year if you wanted to!

All the shows have a good trader presence so you can pick up just what you want.

I know my shop would close if it wasn't for the shows and internet business.

The other factors in the demise of LGS is the internet discounters (many who do it as a hobby, high rents and rates and the impossibility of stocking a decent range of historical miniatures amonst others.

Roland
Stafford Games

Many gamers cry for professionalism with retailers and complain about hobbyists runnings stores. However, the simple truth is that most sane businessmen would not be interested in the gaming industy.

Quite frankly, there is more money to be made running a flower shop (where the lion's share of your business comes from weddings and funerals) or a liquor store. When one thinks of it, there is more money to be made in selling paint (we have a half dozen stores selling paint in our small town) or even repairing lawnmowers.

As far as selling "hobby" items, there is more money in running a quilt shop or a cooking supply store or a scrapbooking store than there is a gaming store. Only a gaming fanatic/hobbyist lacks the good business judgment which would tell him to stay far away from the gaming scene.

No the professional businessmen are in businesses where there is a demand for their products or services.

To give another comparison, an independent auto parts store with an inventory of approximately $300,000 will have sales in excess of $60,000 per month. Their margins are comparable to the hobby business -- approximately 35% to 40%, meaning that their sales after the cost of goods sold is about $20,000 per month. After paying building rent and employee salaries, an owner/manager can probably clear around $10,000 per month.

The hobby industry has nowhere near these sales in relation to the amount of inventory, which explains why the professional businessmen prefer to invest their money elsewhere.

Good to see the discussions are keeping this topic alive!

You need to work damned hard I guess. Bangor is a town of less than 20,000 people though it has a University.

Last year an acquaintance of mine set up a FLGS. On the High Street, but restricted to two second floor rooms.

He sells mainly GW, a few baord games, MTG and FoW.

What impressed me was that he grew his market.

He knows most of his customers will be kids, so he got the requisitve police checks done and set up a gaming club in town – something Bangor has never had as my club is associated with the university.

Then he set up a seperate night for card games. Thus he's got the teenagers playing and buying from his store. He also allows gamers to use his spare room.

He introduced them to FoW, and runs tournaments every month. So the town has probably over a dozen FoW players, or 1 in 1000 of the total population….

He knows his stuff, and is good with bemused parents. He's eager to chat and share knowledge.

And customer service is good. He's always willing to order stuff in specially, and doesn't mind waiting a couple fo weeks for you to pick things up (so long as you do…) as he knows his monthly order doesn't always co-incide with people being flush with cash.

So yes, I could save money buying on the internet. But I give him my custom because I like the idea of having such a gem on my doorstep. I've got paints, glues, flock and figures 15mins walk away.

I asked him last week how things were going. He's making a profit, though not a big one. Since he's in his 20s he lives with his folks so that's OK for now.

Hopefully his on-line sales will increase – but it's a heroic effort and I wish there was one like him in every town!