"Alzo Zero" Topic

Has anyone tried the Alzo Zero/ Italieri rules ?

I got the basic set and the vehicle upgrade and like the look of them but dont have any mates to play them with

anyone had any experience ?

Any opions or examples of play available ?

cheers

Guy

I played this game twice. Don't like it. It's too skewed toward the Americans. It's not enough that the M1 Garand has twice the rate of fire as the Mauser, but the Americans have more lower numbered cards in its deck than the Germans, ensuring that the Americans gets higher initiative on most turns.

It's not balanced at all IMO and there are a lot of playtest issues.

I found that the US is quite balanced. US troops had to rely on their Garands and BAR's to generate firepower. If you tally up the German Mausers they are at a disadvantage, but toss in the MG34/42 and that tips the balance in favour of the Germans.

Here in the Download section you find the newest version of rules, called no Operation World War II
alzozero.it/eng/index.html

Don't know anything about the rules, but in German squads, the infantrymen were essentially there to protect and support the machinegunner, to carry ammunition for him, and to provide replacements if he was shot.

Sounds reasonable to me.

Thanks Chaps,

I'm actually binning the Americans in favor of the Brits so it should make it a bit more intresting.

Any on line reviews or play tests out there ?

Cheers

Guy

I think it's an excellent game.

I don't really like the card system.
You can't really do Ambush games proberly.
f.E. The Americans are moving down the road and suddenly one of the units can't get a move card then they suddenly start firing. But they can't see anything.
AND
I don't like the fact that the units can not see but notice each other through buildings even though they don't have LOS.

Just my oppinion

BAPS

I've played lots of rules and like this game a lot. They are big in Italy. Best thing about it is its free for download but I believe the author intends to release it sometime next year. The rules have now been properly translated from the Italian by Andrew Carless and he's done a good job.

The card system is innovative and novel but if you like to control things too much then no, you won't like your squad suddenly firing at nothing and giving their position away. When you play a few times you learn how to avoid this unless your cards are really stacked against you – but war is hell.

Thanks for that Paul…. completely missed you comment :-). keep watching the site, the Desert rules have now been translated, just got to iron out one problem and they'll be out…

We play them for one-off 20mm games. They're not bad at all. (Note, we play the original version that came with a ton of other stuff – haven't bought the newest, rules-only incarnation).

The complaint about the Garand vs. the Mauser is unfounded. A full-blown squad has roughly equal firepower, and the Americans lose firepower faster because each lost rifleman is 2 dice lost.

There are issues with the rules – tanks are awfully powerful (I know, they were in real life too, but airpower and concealment minimized this in RL, don't in most games), and spotting is deterministic, with no real variance for the quality of spotter.

But they play fast (2 hours for company sized games), and are an enjoyable diversion. I don't like most card systems (after a brief flirtation with IABSM we ditched it over the cards), but this one is pretty solid. You have SOME control, but not complete control – which is what the battlefield is like, you don't control the enemy's actions during a "Go" or some such. They want to shoot you first ;-).

The interminable wait for the Desert has us itching though. We might play more if the OWW Desert stuff was out – we don't have time to spec our own, and Normandy is a long way from Africa where armor is concerned.

Hearing that they're nearly translated is cool!

Regards,
Don.

"There are issues with the rules – tanks are awfully powerful (I know, they were in real life too, but airpower and concealment minimized this in RL, don't in most games), and spotting is deterministic, with no real variance for the quality of spotter."

I totally agree with the above comments. Once a squad has fired and there is a tank about (or indeed any biggish gun), they are dead meat. AFV have little trouble spotting infantry though it is possible for a bazooka team to slowly creep up on a closed down tank and bushwack it.

The technical data and army lists are mighty impressive.
I think more thought needs to be given to the way morale is influenced by the tactical situation for both inf squads and AFVs.

Paul

I totally agree with the above comments. Once a squad has fired and there is a tank about (or indeed any biggish gun), they are dead meat. AFV have little trouble spotting infantry though it is possible for a bazooka team to slowly creep up on a closed down tank and bushwack it.

just a quick note on on your comments paul – I've played quite a lot of OWW2 (It's actually replaced Flames of war as our number 1 club ww2 rules set – no mean feat in New Zealand!) We twigged the same thing about tanks but all it really forced was that we try to think a little more about the sequence of activation for units – trying to force the tank to respond to something else before doing things that we don't want the AFV getting involved in. As far as the visibility goes – AFVs loose 25cm of awareness distance unless the commander is sticking his head out of the turret – this makes him dead meat to snipers and really naffs the morale of the vehicle crew!

on the whole we've found it an excellent game that really makes you think carefully about how to use your troops and 'feels' a lot closer to real (or as real as a table top game can get ;o) ) than a few other offerings out there. No system is perfect but this one gets my vote!

WW2Fanatik wrote:
"I played this game twice. Don't like it. It's too skewed toward the Americans. It's not enough that the M1 Garand has twice the rate of fire as the Mauser, but the Americans have more lower numbered cards in its deck than the Germans, ensuring that the Americans gets higher initiative on most turns.

It's not balanced at all IMO and there are a lot of playtest issues."

Sorry to contradict you, but the cards are equal for both sides. Same number of cards, with the same number of orders and same activation numbers.

The Garand has an higher rate of fire but than the german counter-part but if you look at squad fire power:

US: 2 M1 Carbine = 4 dice
1 BAR = 4 dice
9 Garand = 18
Total = 26 dice (points value 260)

German: 2 MP40 = 6
1 MG42 = 8
3 Kar98K = 3
2 Stg44 = 6
Total = 23 dice (points value 280)

This is according to the OOB from OWWII.

If you go with the OOverlord version you get:

Germans: 28 dice for 260 points
Americans: 28 dice for 240 points

As a personal opinion, I find the game great. The cards make you think and give the game a certain degree of uncertain.

As a final note, from all the games I played so far I think the victories are split between Germans and Allies.

Cheers
Alex

Oh…and the Germans get more cards per turn!!! :)